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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:21 am 
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Sam Allardyce: England manager allegations investigated by FA

[quote=BBC Sport]The Football Association is investigating allegations England manager Sam Allardyce used his role to negotiate a £400,000 deal and offer advice on how to "get around" rules on player transfers.

The Telegraph has footage it says is from August of Allardyce meeting men claiming to represent a Far East firm and appearing to tell them that third-party ownership rules can be avoided.

The 61-year-old has yet to respond to the allegations, while the FA has asked to see the paper's filmed recordings.

It will meet on Tuesday morning when new chairman Greg Clarke and chief executive Martin Glenn must decide whether the issue is one of poor judgement or something more serious.

Allardyce was only named England boss in July, succeeding Roy Hodgson after a disastrous European Championship campaign.

The former Sunderland boss has been in charge for just one game.

"I want all the facts, to hear everything from everyone and make a judgement about what to do," Clarke told The Times.

"Natural justice requires us to get to the bottom of the issues before we make any decision. It is not appropriate to pre-judge the issue. With things like this you have to take a deep breath."

Third-party ownership of players was banned by the FA in 2008.

During the meeting with the businessmen, who were undercover reporters, it is alleged Allardyce said it was "not a problem" to bypass the rules and he knew of agents who were "doing it all the time".

It is further alleged by the paper that a deal was struck with the England boss worth £400,000 for him to represent the company to Far East investors and to be a keynote speaker at events.

Allardyce tells the undercover reporters that any arrangement would have to be cleared by the FA.

Third-party ownership, in which investment companies take a stake in the economic rights of players, was described as a form of "slavery" by Michel Platini, the former president of European football's governing body Uefa.

World football's governing body Fifa banned the practice in May last year.

Allardyce attended the meeting with the fictitious businessmen in London along with his agent, Mark Curtis, and his financial adviser, Shane Moloney.

During the meeting he said Enner Valencia had been under a third-party ownership agreement when he signed the Ecuador forward for £12m for West Ham from Mexican club Pachuca in 2014, but that the third-party ownership ended on the transfer and the Hammers acquired the player "whole".

Curtis and Moloney have not yet responded to the allegations.

In the Telegraph recording, Allardyce also refers to predecessor Hodgson, as "Woy", referencing his speech impediment.

He also criticises former assistant coach Gary Neville - saying Hodgson should have told him to "sit down and shut up" - as well as the FA's decision to "stupidly" rebuild Wembley Stadium at a cost of £870m.

Former Blackpool, Notts County, Bolton, Newcastle, Blackburn and West Ham manager Allardyce succeeded Hodgson, who quit after England were knocked out of Euro 2016 in the last 16 by Iceland.

He has had just one game in charge of the national side - a 1-0 win over Slovakia in a 2018 World Cup qualifier earlier this month.

He is due to name his squad on Sunday for the forthcoming World Cup qualifiers, including his first Wembley match in charge against Malta on 8 October (17:00 BST kick-off).

Former England international Chris Waddle told BBC Radio 5 live that Allardyce had been "naive" and was now in a difficult position.

He added: "They are only allegations but if true he will do well to keep his job. Hopefully there's nothing at the end of it and he continues."

It is not the first time allegations have been made against Allardyce following an investigation by journalists. A BBC Panorama programme in 2006 contained claims by an agent who said he had paid bungs to the then-Bolton boss.

Allardyce vehemently denied the claims and a subsequent FA investigation found no evidence of wrongdoing.[/quote]

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:41 pm 
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Blimey that's bad news for Allardyce and England if true.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:39 pm 
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murtonquaker wrote:
During the meeting he said Enner Valencia had been under a third-party ownership agreement when he signed the Ecuador forward for £12m for West Ham from Mexican club Pachuca in 2014, but that the third-party ownership ended on the transfer and the Hammers acquired the player "whole".


The strange bit is this.

Allardyce knows the way of getting round the third party ownership piece...buying them out of third party ownership.

Pretty sure that is like saying the secret to opening a door is to pull the handle.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 5:12 pm 
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Well maybe that's what he told them?

Very stupid if he's been caught out - he must know England managers are a target for this kind of thing, especially ones whose brothers have been done for dodgy transfer dealings.

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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:
Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:38 pm 
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I can't see him surviving this, with more revelations to follow. The FA want to appear to be whiter than white, if Allardyce stays then they could be accused of double standards.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:46 pm 
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He's resigned

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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:
Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:53 pm 
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Spyman wrote:
He's resigned

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I was right for once, well this will put the FA into turmoil and who gets the job next. I doubt the FA will make an appointment until the Daily Telegraph have finished their revelations. What a coup for the Telegraph.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:22 pm 
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Gawd help us Gareth Southgate takes over as caretaker manager.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 11:28 am 
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Darlo_Pete wrote:
Gawd help us Gareth Southgate takes over as caretaker manager.

Is he taking over for the full qualifying campaign or just a few games?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 11:30 am 
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He's in charge for the next 4 games and then someone will be appointed full-time for the March qualifiers. I'm just worried that we'll muddle through the next 4 qualifiers and they'll offer Southgate the job on a permanent basis.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 1:34 pm 
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Seeing as Bruce was the only other candidate considered over the summer I'd be surprised if he's not offered the job.

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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:
Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 2:47 pm 
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Spyman wrote:
Seeing as Bruce was the only other candidate considered over the summer I'd be surprised if he's not offered the job.


Wenger was in the running and I suspect thats where the FA will want to go. Muddle through this season with Southgate then look to appoint Wenger, who will have just complete 20 years with Arsenal.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:55 pm 
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BaronsCourtQuaker wrote:
Spyman wrote:
Seeing as Bruce was the only other candidate considered over the summer I'd be surprised if he's not offered the job.


Wenger was in the running and I suspect thats where the FA will want to go. Muddle through this season with Southgate then look to appoint Wenger, who will have just complete 20 years with Arsenal.

Could be right. Although if Southgate doesn't get the required results can they afford to stick with him until next summer? How many games is that?

On the other side of the coin, if Southgate turns us into a coherent team do throw him out because a 70 year old Frenchman is available for a couple of years?

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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:
Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:26 pm 
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Steve Staunton would be able to qualify with England. Qualification isn't really the problem at all but I would hate to go into a major tournament with Southgate at the helm regardless of how qualifiers go.

Wenger strengths as a club manager have been buying players to suit his style of play. Often buying them young and developing them. Is that really suited to international management?

I don't know where we go frankly.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:42 am 
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BaronsCourtQuaker wrote:
Spyman wrote:
Seeing as Bruce was the only other candidate considered over the summer I'd be surprised if he's not offered the job.


Wenger was in the running and I suspect thats where the FA will want to go. Muddle through this season with Southgate then look to appoint Wenger, who will have just complete 20 years with Arsenal.


I'd love Wenger to take charge, he has all the credentials and experience to get the best out of an England team.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:29 pm 
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Hijacking this thread as the corruption in English football thread.

Tommy Wright being sacked suggests that maybe he did come back full of recommendations of new signings in return for transfer bungs.

The rest seem to be a bit of a loose accusations of "look at this bad man, we offered him £400k to fly all expenses paid to Singapore and make a speech".

I have seen nothing to date that Sam Allardyce actually had a way around the third party ownership piece other than explaining that he bought Ener Valencia in full (which is the official right way to do it) and he took the mick out of Roy Hodgson.

I dunno all feels a bit of fuss about very little.

Oh and Cellino the owner of Leeds might be dodgy, in other news the Pope might be Catholic.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:23 pm 
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Spyman wrote:
Could be right. Although if Southgate doesn't get the required results can they afford to stick with him until next summer? How many games is that?

On the other side of the coin, if Southgate turns us into a coherent team do throw him out because a 70 year old Frenchman is available for a couple of years?


England must qualify out of the group and this actually I think works in the favour of the FA's and Wenger. Though I do hear your point about the long term benefits of hiring a 70 year old Frenchman.

I’m really not sure where we go. I didn't like the idea of Sam but there was nothing else. Post Sam we are left with nothing else. Could ruin the prospects of the likes of Howe or Dyche if they were to be given the big step up. Or we go foreign which is a kick in the teeth for the home grown English managers and coaches. Also its football let’s see where we are come the end of the season I guess.

lo36789 wrote:
I dunno all feels a bit of fuss about very little.


They were much my thoughts until you start to think about it.

I’m not sure Sam has actually done anything wrong. However the suggestions he was happy to talk to people about how you break the rules of the organisation he works for is a little close to the line. Bit like a bank worker telling people how to rob his bank then taking £400k for the explanation.

It also leads on to the question 'are managers, coaches, owner or scouts doing right by your club. Or are they signing / playing players because they are being paid too rather than the quality of the player? There is then the suggestion that all of these payment are much more subtle than that. Manger brings on youth team player for last 5 minutes of games, the youth team manager then gets a bonus based on the success of his academy, youth team manger then gives manager 10% cut'

Having said all of that if any of this comes as a surprise to people I’d be amazed. I doubt the FA are above their own standards and just (like a lot of things these days) makes me more distant to the top levels of football.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:30 pm 
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BaronsCourtQuaker wrote:
I’m not sure Sam has actually done anything wrong. However the suggestions he was happy to talk to people about how you break the rules of the organisation he works for is a little close to the line. Bit like a bank worker telling people how to rob his bank then taking £400k for the explanation.


That's not quite right though - I am pretty sure it was reported Sam said yes to £400k to fly out and do a speech in the 'far east', but he caveated and said "I will need to check with the FA first obviously".

The two things were independent and separate discussions that have been thrown together.

On the third party ownership he effectively said "there are ways around that, I know agents who do it all the time" then said about them buying Ener Valencia who was under third party ownership. That to me was his 'way around that' but from what I understand that way around it was completely above board. Basically you buy out the third party owner share.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:05 pm 
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Darlo_Pete wrote:
He's in charge for the next 4 games and then someone will be appointed full-time for the March qualifiers. I'm just worried that we'll muddle through the next 4 qualifiers and they'll offer Southgate the job on a permanent basis.


Could he do worse than his predecessors (Allardyce aside)? :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:24 pm 
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joejaques wrote:
Darlo_Pete wrote:
He's in charge for the next 4 games and then someone will be appointed full-time for the March qualifiers. I'm just worried that we'll muddle through the next 4 qualifiers and they'll offer Southgate the job on a permanent basis.


Could he do worse than his predecessors (Allardyce aside)? :roll:


Hodgson did fine in the qualifiers, it was just when we got to the finals that the problems started.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 10:52 am 
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Darlo_Pete wrote:
joejaques wrote:
Darlo_Pete wrote:
He's in charge for the next 4 games and then someone will be appointed full-time for the March qualifiers. I'm just worried that we'll muddle through the next 4 qualifiers and they'll offer Southgate the job on a permanent basis.


Could he do worse than his predecessors (Allardyce aside)? :roll:


Hodgson did fine in the qualifiers, it was just when we got to the finals that the problems started.


So, when it got serious, he choked. Haven't we heard that tale before? :roll:

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