Lock up your daughters!

[Spyman]

I know they say lightning never strikes twice and all that, but you'd have thought all these football clubs would know better than to tease a covicted rapist like this.

[davidcorks 40yard OG]

I know they say lightning never strikes twice and all that, but you'd have thought all these football clubs would know better than to tease a covicted rapist like this.

Shouldnt laugh really but thats first rate

[theoriginalfatcat]

If Oldham pull out, which looks likely as the sponsors are giving out bad vibes, then the change will have to come from Evans.

He either gives up trying to find a club until his appeal is heard, or repents.

[Lawman3]

Evans was convicted by a Jury who heard all the live evidence. He sought leave to Appeal which was turned down by a Judge. He then made a further application for leave to Appeal, which was again turned down and the original verdict upheld. His application for a review is really his last throw of the dice, and I'd be very surprised if the verdict is overturned. He is, therefore, a convicted rapist. He has served only half his sentence, and remains on licence for the remainder. This part of the sentence is to deal with rehabilitation, but it is hard to rehabilitate someone who won't admit they have done wrong.

Evans is typical of the arrogant, rich Footballer who believes they can act with impunity, and he was caught out. His actions, at worst, were those of a predatory rapist, and, at best, those of an opportunist with a cavalier attitude towards consent. I, personally, would take with a pinch of salt what is written on his website. He, his family, and friends, have engaged in a PR campaign to paint him as the victim. The actual victim has repeatedly been smeared, has been subjected to threats and harassment, and had to change her identity.

Even his Aunt says he raped the victim, and should face up to it. Unless, and until, he accepts responsibility, and expresses remorse, he can expect to face outrage and protests at his attempts to slot back into the life he had before his conviction.

[Darlo_Pete]

Do doubt all the feminists will be signing the petitions against Evans. The majority of real fans would probably welcome him. He's served his time, so he should be allowed to get on with his life and career.

[lo36789]

damn all those pesky feminists who think women should have equality. All of them will surely sign this petition...

Lawman hits nail on head. If his appeal is rejected he has to at least publicly show remorse and apologise.

The courts judge that he is not a risk to women. I don't believe that playing football in front of a few thousand people increases that risk (very different to child sex offenders supervising children in the future). In reality I doubt his girlfriend will let him go to the shops on his own nevermind any more nights out with Clayton.

[TSQuaker]

damn all those pesky feminists who think women should have equality. All of them will surely sign this petition...

Lawman hits nail on head. If his appeal is rejected he has to at least publicly show remorse and apologise.

The courts judge that he is not a risk to women. I don't believe that playing football in front of a few thousand people increases that risk (very different to child sex offenders supervising children in the future). In reality I doubt his girlfriend will let him go to the shops on his own nevermind any more nights out with Clayton.

Why should he show any remorse if his appeal is rejected?

[lo36789]

"The law has said I did this. I have to accept that what I did was wrong and unacceptable and I apologise for what the victim has endured."

Why, because by law he is guilty, he shows no remorse, so how can anyone claim he has been rehabilitated. He can see out the other 2.5 years as I don't know what he has done to deserve early release!?

[TSQuaker]

Having to accept it and admitting it are two very different things.

[PaulMJohnson]

Evans was convicted by a Jury who heard all the live evidence. He sought leave to Appeal which was turned down by a Judge. He then made a further application for leave to Appeal, which was again turned down and the original verdict upheld. His application for a review is really his last throw of the dice, and I'd be very surprised if the verdict is overturned. He is, therefore, a convicted rapist. He has served only half his sentence, and remains on licence for the remainder. This part of the sentence is to deal with rehabilitation, but it is hard to rehabilitate someone who won't admit they have done wrong.

Shortened the quote so as to not take up too much space, but that's a terrific summary Lawman. As you say, once his review is turned down, which it seems likely it will be, he is, unequivocally, a convicted rapist. It doesn't matter how much he protests his innocence, prisons are full of people who "did nothing, honest".

However, with all that acknowledged, the broader question is, "what do we do with our convicted criminals, once released"? Considering most professional footballers tend to start immediately out of school, what is he good for except playing football? It's a problem somewhat unique to professional sports, as if he restarted working in any other walk of life, he wouldn't be cheered for his actions at work.

There's a similar debate going on on this side of the pond at the moment, after multiple American Footballers were found to be women and children beaters (and famously one of them a dog fighter).

Personally, I'm open to them being allowed back into their sport, assuming they have shown some contrition. Michael Vick (the guy who ran the dog fighting ring) has had a successful career after he came out of prison, but has shown remorse for what he did.

That's where Evans is falling down for me. I wouldn't have too much of a problem with him playing again, if he showed any remorse. Until that happens, he should be treated like the pariah he is.

[lo36789]

after multiple American Footballers were found to be women

They're what?

[Henley]

Evans was convicted by a Jury who heard all the live evidence. He sought leave to Appeal which was turned down by a Judge. He then made a further application for leave to Appeal, which was again turned down and the original verdict upheld. His application for a review is really his last throw of the dice, and I'd be very surprised if the verdict is overturned. He is, therefore, a convicted rapist. He has served only half his sentence, and remains on licence for the remainder. This part of the sentence is to deal with rehabilitation, but it is hard to rehabilitate someone who won't admit they have done wrong.

Evans is typical of the arrogant, rich Footballer who believes they can act with impunity, and he was caught out. His actions, at worst, were those of a predatory rapist, and, at best, those of an opportunist with a cavalier attitude towards consent. I, personally, would take with a pinch of salt what is written on his website. He, his family, and friends, have engaged in a PR campaign to paint him as the victim. The actual victim has repeatedly been smeared, has been subjected to threats and harassment, and had to change her identity.

Even his Aunt says he raped the victim, and should face up to it. Unless, and until, he accepts responsibility, and expresses remorse, he can expect to face outrage and protests at his attempts to slot back into the life he had before his conviction.

Was his Aunt in the hotel room with them?

[Henley]

Evans was convicted by a Jury who heard all the live evidence. He sought leave to Appeal which was turned down by a Judge. He then made a further application for leave to Appeal, which was again turned down and the original verdict upheld. His application for a review is really his last throw of the dice, and I'd be very surprised if the verdict is overturned. He is, therefore, a convicted rapist. He has served only half his sentence, and remains on licence for the remainder. This part of the sentence is to deal with rehabilitation, but it is hard to rehabilitate someone who won't admit they have done wrong.

Shortened the quote so as to not take up too much space, but that's a terrific summary Lawman. As you say, once his review is turned down, which it seems likely it will be, he is, unequivocally, a convicted rapist. It doesn't matter how much he protests his innocence, prisons are full of people who "did nothing, honest".

However, with all that acknowledged, the broader question is, "what do we do with our convicted criminals, once released"? Considering most professional footballers tend to start immediately out of school, what is he good for except playing football? It's a problem somewhat unique to professional sports, as if he restarted working in any other walk of life, he wouldn't be cheered for his actions at work.

There's a similar debate going on on this side of the pond at the moment, after multiple American Footballers were found to be women and children beaters (and famously one of them a dog fighter).

Personally, I'm open to them being allowed back into their sport, assuming they have shown some contrition. Michael Vick (the guy who ran the dog fighting ring) has had a successful career after he came out of prison, but has shown remorse for what he did.

That's where Evans is falling down for me. I wouldn't have too much of a problem with him playing again, if he showed any remorse. Until that happens, he should be treated like the pariah he is.

What goes through peoples minds before they type?

How can you expect anyone to have remorse for a crime they say they didn't do and for which there is no evidence for? Unbelievable logic

I'd like to frame you up for a crime so I can see if you have remorse when found guilty.

[DarloOnTheUp]

Evans was convicted by a Jury who heard all the live evidence. He sought leave to Appeal which was turned down by a Judge. He then made a further application for leave to Appeal, which was again turned down and the original verdict upheld. His application for a review is really his last throw of the dice, and I'd be very surprised if the verdict is overturned. He is, therefore, a convicted rapist. He has served only half his sentence, and remains on licence for the remainder. This part of the sentence is to deal with rehabilitation, but it is hard to rehabilitate someone who won't admit they have done wrong.

Shortened the quote so as to not take up too much space, but that's a terrific summary Lawman. As you say, once his review is turned down, which it seems likely it will be, he is, unequivocally, a convicted rapist. It doesn't matter how much he protests his innocence, prisons are full of people who "did nothing, honest".

However, with all that acknowledged, the broader question is, "what do we do with our convicted criminals, once released"? Considering most professional footballers tend to start immediately out of school, what is he good for except playing football? It's a problem somewhat unique to professional sports, as if he restarted working in any other walk of life, he wouldn't be cheered for his actions at work.

There's a similar debate going on on this side of the pond at the moment, after multiple American Footballers were found to be women and children beaters (and famously one of them a dog fighter).

Personally, I'm open to them being allowed back into their sport, assuming they have shown some contrition. Michael Vick (the guy who ran the dog fighting ring) has had a successful career after he came out of prison, but has shown remorse for what he did.

That's where Evans is falling down for me. I wouldn't have too much of a problem with him playing again, if he showed any remorse. Until that happens, he should be treated like the pariah he is.

Right yeah, because the jury system is 100% infallible and they never get anything wrong.

Although I find it funny that one minute you and Lawman are suggesting we should rely on the justice system and accept the verdict of the jury but the next you're saying we should take justice into our own hands and stop him from getting on with his life. Make your fucking mind up.

And perhaps he's showing no remorse because he doesn't think he's guilty? And based on what I've heard of the case, I tend to agree with him. I'm honestly struggling to see where any rape took place. I thought we needed evidence to prosecute people?

I can guarantee you now that he will regret what happened, so he has shown remorse about that, but he just doesn't accept the conviction (that he raped the girl). So he has shown remorse for the act.

Either way, whether he's guilty or not, he's served his time. Let him get on with it: he didn't get a life sentence FFS.

[theoriginalfatcat]

The majority of real fans would probably welcome him.

I very much doubt this! I'm "a real" Darlo fan and I wouldn't want him representing my team. Evans is a controversial figure, look what happened at H'pool, look at the mixed opinions on this thread.

And as for serving his time - he's out on license as he's only served half of his sentence. There are certain things he can't do for fear of getting banged up again.

[Darlogramps]

The majority of real fans would probably welcome him.

And as for serving his time - he's out on license as he's only served half of his sentence. There are certain things he can't do for fear of getting banged up again.

This isn't the point though.

When people talk about him "serving his time, " the point is now he's out of prison, he's entitled to seek employment in whatever field he chooses, just like the rest of us.

That's where I'm uncomfortable with the protests and petitions. I don't think it's right that people try to dictate where he can or can't work, when there's no legal basis for them to do so.

Yes people are entitled to their opinions, but that's all they are. It's up to the club to decide, not a bunch of anonymous petition signers with no link to Oldham, or whoever.

Some of the stuff published by the anti-Evans mob is beyond belief. One feminist in the Independent went as far to say "He might offend again." Might?

A libellous hypothetical - you can't criticise someone by saying they might do something when you have nothing to back that up.

[onewayup]

Ched Evans is his own worst enemy,if he had any brains he would be back playing,
Logic tells me that if he showed any contrition at all he would be under the radar,the hullabaloo is only because no apology or contrition has been forthcoming.

[DarloOnTheUp]

Ched Evans is his own worst enemy,if he had any brains he would be back playing,
Logic tells me that if he showed any contrition at all he would be under the radar,the hullabaloo is only because no apology or contrition has been forthcoming.

He has already apologised for the act, just not for rape since he is obviously maintaining that it was consensual.

[thewanderingquaker]

There is an excellent article by Mick Dennis in today's Express about the Evans situation. He cites the cases of 3 other footballers, Luke McCormick (who killed 2 young boys in a car crash whilst drunk), but currently playing for Plymouth; Lee Hughes (who killed another driver, ran away from the scene and waited 2 days to hand himself in), but continued to play for various teams whilst awaiting trial and after serving his sentence; and Adam Chapman who plays for Newport who killed another driver whilst using his mobile phone. There was no furore over these players continuing to play or returning to the game after serving their sentences. Are these crimes any less heinous that what Evans did, but they were all alowwed to continue or resume playing? They were or are supposed to be "role models".
As he says in his final paragraph, "Evans has an absolute right to resume his playing career, but I would not want him playing for the club I support", which is probably what most of us would say.

[Robbie Painter]

Henry Winter of the Telegraph has an excellent article on Evans, I fully agree with it:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/footba ... riker.html

[theoriginalfatcat]

I reckon Reynolds would have given him a run out!

Getting a good player on the cheap would have been irresistible to him, and he wouldn't have cared much re fans/sponsors/public opinion.

[DarloOnTheUp]

Henry Winter of the Telegraph has an excellent article on Evans, I fully agree with it:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/footba ... riker.html

That article isn't "excellent", it's self-righteous nonsense.

[Mick]

Interesting debate this. Just a question for the sympathisers:
If some random bloke forcibly put his cock into one of the female members of your family, would you feel exactly the same way about him as you would if that same bloke had killed the same female in a drink driving accident?

[Mick]

Evans was convicted by a Jury who heard all the live evidence. He sought leave to Appeal which was turned down by a Judge. He then made a further application for leave to Appeal, which was again turned down and the original verdict upheld. His application for a review is really his last throw of the dice, and I'd be very surprised if the verdict is overturned. He is, therefore, a convicted rapist. He has served only half his sentence, and remains on licence for the remainder. This part of the sentence is to deal with rehabilitation, but it is hard to rehabilitate someone who won't admit they have done wrong.

Evans is typical of the arrogant, rich Footballer who believes they can act with impunity, and he was caught out. His actions, at worst, were those of a predatory rapist, and, at best, those of an opportunist with a cavalier attitude towards consent. I, personally, would take with a pinch of salt what is written on his website. He, his family, and friends, have engaged in a PR campaign to paint him as the victim. The actual victim has repeatedly been smeared, has been subjected to threats and harassment, and had to change her identity.

Even his Aunt says he raped the victim, and should face up to it. Unless, and until, he accepts responsibility, and expresses remorse, he can expect to face outrage and protests at his attempts to slot back into the life he had before his conviction.

Was his Aunt in the hotel room with them?

No. Were you?

[DarloOnTheUp]

Interesting debate this. Just a question for the sympathisers:
If some random bloke forcibly put his cock into one of the female members of your family, would you feel exactly the same way about him as you would if that same bloke had killed the same female in a drink driving accident?

Yes, but the point is that in this case, it isn't clear cut. As I said before, I'm struggling to see where any rape actually took place.

And also as I said before, whether he's guilty or not, he should be allowed to get on with his career and life. He's served the time which was deemed adequate for the crime. He didn't get a life sentence.

All of this pariah nonsense needs to stop. I appreciate that everyone has different views on the issue but to forcibly stop him from moving on and having a career in what is probably the only thing he's good at is ridiculous.

If you're going to trust the justice system with regards to the verdict, then you need to apply the same logic to the punishment.

[Mick]

Interesting debate this. Just a question for the sympathisers:
If some random bloke forcibly put his cock into one of the female members of your family, would you feel exactly the same way about him as you would if that same bloke had killed the same female in a drink driving accident?

Yes, but the point is that in this case, it isn't clear cut. As I said before, I'm struggling to see where any rape actually took place.

And also as I said before, whether he's guilty or not, he should be allowed to get on with his career and life. He's served the time which was deemed adequate for the crime. He didn't get a life sentence.

All of this pariah nonsense needs to stop. I appreciate that everyone has different views on the issue but to forcibly stop him from moving on and having a career in what is probably the only thing he's good at is ridiculous.

If you're going to trust the justice system with regards to the verdict, then you need to apply the same logic to the punishment.

Thanks for the honest answer. I think that's where the problem lies in the whole debate, where one side thinks that rape is the same as any other crime. I don't so my view differs.
I also struggle to understand the logic that you say you "struggle to see where rape took place". That was for the justice system to decide. You can't surely say that you're sitting above that so it's to be disregarded because he was a good lad and therefore must mean the victim was a slag?

I understand your view that he didn't get a life sentence, but for a hell of a lot of people the moral view overrides that argument. Me included.

He's a convicted rapist and guilty as charged. As a society we have a moral obligation not to let him continue in the public limelight. End of story for me.

No disrespect intended to the sympathisers, but you're wrong. But only on a moral level.

[DarloOnTheUp]

I also struggle to understand the logic that you say you "struggle to see where rape took place". That was for the justice system to decide.

As was the punishment, yet you don't seem to want to accept that.

And what if the jury was wrong?

[theoriginalfatcat]

Was his Aunt in the hotel room with them?

Perhaps she was outside the hotel window along with her other nephew, you know - Ched's brother?

[theoriginalfatcat]

Interesting debate this. Just a question for the sympathisers:
If some random bloke forcibly put his cock into one of the female members of your family, would you feel exactly the same way about him as you would if that same bloke had killed the same female in a drink driving accident?

Yes, but the point is that in this case, it isn't clear cut. As I said before, I'm struggling to see where any rape actually took place.

And also as I said before, whether he's guilty or not, he should be allowed to get on with his career and life. He's served the time which was deemed adequate for the crime. He didn't get a life sentence.

All of this pariah nonsense needs to stop. I appreciate that everyone has different views on the issue but to forcibly stop him from moving on and having a career in what is probably the only thing he's good at is ridiculous.

If you're going to trust the justice system with regards to the verdict, then you need to apply the same logic to the punishment.

I see your point DarloOnTheUp but the justice system is not in control of public opinion, and it's public opinion that at the moment is stopping Evans from getting work as a Pro footballer. He could do stuff to help this situation, but........

In any case showbiz and politics is littered with people who will never be accepted back into the public eye. I mean Gary Glitter, he's done his time but you're not going to see him cavorting around on Jools Holland's "Later"

[Mick]

I also struggle to understand the logic that you say you "struggle to see where rape took place". That was for the justice system to decide.

As was the punishment, yet you don't seem to want to accept that.

And what if the jury was wrong?

On the contrary, the punishment was befitting. 2 1/2 years for what was possibly a moment of madness is just desserts. A lot would argue that it isn't enough. Yes you could argue that he's being punished further but again, it boils down to the moral aspect. He forced his cock into a female until proven otherwise in a court of law. There's no grey area there. Not in this country. This isn't Botswana.

This ongoing "what if" debate doesn't hold any water for me. He's either guilty or he isn't, as decided by the judicial system. If it goes to appeal and he's successful then I'll do a complete U turn. But that isn't the case at this time, so my view stands.