Hoofball

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B_Little
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Hoofball

Post by B_Little » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:05 pm

After watching Halesowen V's Darlo and watch Darlo play hoofball for 75 minutes and only playing some passing footy for the last 15 minutes but only after being 2 goals to the good.

I'm guessing Darlo didn't get out of hoofball gear yesterday as they never got ahead in the game.

Albeit the style of football gets results its not very inspiring.

Does anyone know the stat for goals scored from open play and dead ball situations. I bet over 70% of goals score are from dead ball. Again it gets results but not great entertainment.

Come on Darlo play some descent footy.

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divas
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Re: Hoofball

Post by divas » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:09 pm

This old chestnut, always rears its head after a defeat.

If anything I thought we tried to pass it more in the last 2 games and we've not looked great.

The direct style we've employed most of the time over the past 3 seasons has Ben responsible for getting us to where we are.

My opinion
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Re: Hoofball

Post by My opinion » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:30 pm

divas wrote:This old chestnut, always rears its head after a defeat.

If anything I thought we tried to pass it more in the last 2 games and we've not looked great.

The direct style we've employed most of the time over the past 3 seasons has Ben responsible for getting us to where we are.
I never saw any passing of the ball on the ground from either side yesterday, I have never seen the ball booted in the air as often..Both sides were at it

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divas
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Re: Hoofball

Post by divas » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:38 pm

We were caught in possession so many times in the first half when trying to keep it on the floor.

al_quaker
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Re: Hoofball

Post by al_quaker » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:38 pm

I think we've attempted to play more possession based football this season, what with the addition of Turnbull. We still do play direct as well (certainly not "hoofball" which makes it sound aimless - it's not), and this has proven very effective for us. I also think it is entertaining when done well, which we normally do.

Do we have to go through massive soul searching after every defeat? It's ridiculous, and makes us look overentitled. No team plays well every week, and as we progress back up the leagues we are going to lose more and more games. I think some Darlo fans have forgotten how to lose to be honest.

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CrazyDarlo
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Re: Hoofball

Post by CrazyDarlo » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:55 pm

Personally i have nothing wrong with the "hoofball" tactic and i don't think we've ever just been an out and out long ball team to be honest.

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D_F_C
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Re: Hoofball

Post by D_F_C » Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:57 pm

al_quaker wrote:I think we've attempted to play more possession based football this season, what with the addition of Turnbull. We still do play direct as well (certainly not "hoofball" which makes it sound aimless - it's not), and this has proven very effective for us. I also think it is entertaining when done well, which we normally do.

Do we have to go through massive soul searching after every defeat? It's ridiculous, and makes us look overentitled. No team plays well every week, and as we progress back up the leagues we are going to lose more and more games. I think some Darlo fans have forgotten how to lose to be honest.
yes yes and yes.

If where we are today was offered, 2nd in league but out of FA cup to a team who were 2 leagues above us last year, most would take it

Darlogramps
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Re: Hoofball

Post by Darlogramps » Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:20 pm

"Hoofball" is a pathetic, simplistic phrase, used by brain-dead morons who seem to be thinking a Step 3 non-league club should be playing like Barcelona every week.

It's amazing how no one complained about style of play when we played a tonne of balls for Armstrong to score off.

It's clear Gray likes to use a strong targetman and a smaller striker to feed off (hence why Armstrong/White are used instead of Dowson alongside Cartman).

It gives us the outlet to relieve pressure quickly, and has been particularly effective because Armstrong is a strong, physical presence.

And I also despise the idea that direct long-ball tactics are somehow inferior to playing quick passing football. There is no "right" way to play football.
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Re: Hoofball

Post by My opinion » Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:49 pm

Darlogramps wrote:"Hoofball" is a pathetic, simplistic phrase, used by brain-dead morons who seem to be thinking a Step 3 non-league club should be playing like Barcelona every week.

It's amazing how no one complained about style of play when we played a tonne of balls for Armstrong to score off.

It's clear Gray likes to use a strong targetman and a smaller striker to feed off (hence why Armstrong/White are used instead of Dowson alongside Cartman).

It gives us the outlet to relieve pressure quickly, and has been particularly effective because Armstrong is a strong, physical presence.

And I also despise the idea that direct long-ball tactics are somehow inferior to playing quick passing football. There is no "right" way to play football.
There you go again Gramps.
Calling people names because they have a different view than you of how they like to see football played.
Some of us prefer the Brian Clough style...nothing wrong with that and so they air their view. NO-ONE expects Barcelona style play, But some step 3 and step 4 teams have played against us and have showed a fine style of football (in my opinion) by playing simple pass and move football
Some like the old Wimbledon style of play, again nothing wrong with that and some of those air there points on this forum on that as well.
This is a forum after all and all are allowed to air their view...We all pay our money to watch the team play and as such we are allowed our opinions
As you say, there is no "right" way.
So stop coming out with your stupid and childish calling of names just because their view is different than yours

Darlogramps
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Re: Hoofball

Post by Darlogramps » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:48 pm

My opinion wrote:
Darlogramps wrote:"Hoofball" is a pathetic, simplistic phrase, used by brain-dead morons who seem to be thinking a Step 3 non-league club should be playing like Barcelona every week.

It's amazing how no one complained about style of play when we played a tonne of balls for Armstrong to score off.

It's clear Gray likes to use a strong targetman and a smaller striker to feed off (hence why Armstrong/White are used instead of Dowson alongside Cartman).

It gives us the outlet to relieve pressure quickly, and has been particularly effective because Armstrong is a strong, physical presence.

And I also despise the idea that direct long-ball tactics are somehow inferior to playing quick passing football. There is no "right" way to play football.
There you go again Gramps.
Calling people names because they have a different view than you of how they like to see football played.
Some of us prefer the Brian Clough style...nothing wrong with that and so they air their view. NO-ONE expects Barcelona style play, But some step 3 and step 4 teams have played against us and have showed a fine style of football (in my opinion) by playing simple pass and move football
Some like the old Wimbledon style of play, again nothing wrong with that and some of those air there points on this forum on that as well.
This is a forum after all and all are allowed to air their view...We all pay our money to watch the team play and as such we are allowed our opinions
As you say, there is no "right" way.
So stop coming out with your stupid and childish calling of names just because their view is different than yours
I'll post in the style I like, thanks. If it upsets you or anyone else, I'm not that bothered.

But if you're going to criticise me, at least get it right.

If you'd cared to read my post properly, you'd see I'm not calling supporters of passing football brain-dead morons.

I'm calling anyone who describes Darlo's style of play as "hoofball" as brain-dead morons, because they cannot comprehend why Gray employs this tactic.

Nor do I say I prefer one brand over the other. Just that I don't understand why long-ball is viewed as being inferior to quick passing play.

So carry on with your holier-than-thou act if you want, but ultimately you've shown you've been incapable of following the argument put forward.

Whether that was deliberate or not, only you will know.

And despite your protestations, there are people who think we should play passing football no matter what (like the OP) regardless of how unfeasible that is for a non-league side.

"Simple pass and move" is possible on good pitches against sides looking to get forward. But on mudbaths against sides who are parking the bus, or hard pitches which cause unorthodox bounce (like Lancaster away last season) it simply isn't.

So your point is too simplistic and generalised.

I notice you hide behind the "Brian Clough liked passing football" myth, even though he was far more pragmatic than is made out. Do a bit of research if you don't believe me.

In fact, if you look behind the constructs created by football fans and the media, you'll see most managers tend to be, particularly nowadays when the emphasis is all on results.
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Beano
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Re: Hoofball

Post by Beano » Mon Sep 14, 2015 12:01 am

There is a world of difference between the direct nature of play we utilise and 'hoofball'.

British football has always been direct due to the weather and quality of pitch. Jonathan Wilson's Inverting the Pyramid addresses this and why other nations have particular developed styles.

Fatty eats roadkill
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Re: Hoofball

Post by Fatty eats roadkill » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:28 am

Hoofball? Is that football for cows?
Waiting for Raj to shaft them!

MikeinBlack2
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Re: Hoofball

Post by MikeinBlack2 » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:40 am

We never lost on Saturday because of the style of football played (hoof ball or otherwise) we lost because we were ineffective in attack and sloppy in defence. We had enough attempts on target to score a couple but simply didn't finish well enough.
Come on Darlo!
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Darlo_Pete
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Re: Hoofball

Post by Darlo_Pete » Mon Sep 14, 2015 7:54 am

We seem to revert to the long ball once the opposition strikers press our defence. I've noticed that we have been playing longer balls from the defence, more often over the last few weeks.

lo36789
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Re: Hoofball

Post by lo36789 » Mon Sep 14, 2015 8:52 am

Darlo_Pete wrote:We seem to revert to the long ball once the opposition strikers press our defence.
Well good. Tippy-tappy when you are being pressed by opposition defenders is a sure fire way to lose goals, particularly at this level where player and pitch quality isn't that high.

Anyone experienced in the art of champ man knows that if the opposition has Passing: short then you play Pressing: Yes. Similarly if they are setting themselves up to press if you play direct then you will exploit the gaps that they leave behind.

From what I saw of the highlights, and the comments here from sensible posters - there are quite an increasing number that I ignore - it wasn't tactics that we got wrong on Saturday it was too many individual poor performances - unfortunately that is near impossible to control.

It is in times like that you could do with the crowd to inspire/drive the team on, it sounds like that was quite poor as well.

richymidd
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Re: Hoofball

Post by richymidd » Mon Sep 14, 2015 9:06 am

I commented similarly after watching the Halesowen game.

I don't think we played a senseless long-ball game but we do tend to play very directly.

My point was more that a swing of the foot was very often used when there was ample time to get the ball down, have a look and see what the options were. It did seem to be quite one-dimensional. Surely we should be looking to explore, and practice, other options.....the direct approach will not always work and we should be thinking about how else we look to break teams down. Opposition, pitch, weather will all be different and I'm sure we have the capability in Gray and squad to start to be a bit more progressive and adapt to what each game brings.

I would also like to see us more comfortable on the ball, happy to retain possession in our own half or the middle third, while looking to develop something.

Halesowen was actually pretty dull for large periods of the game and it was frustrating not to see the flashes of good, close football (as used down the right in the buildup to one of the goals) used more often. 3 pts yes, in a game we pretty much cruised, but I just came away feeling a little bit empty....

TFDM
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Re: Hoofball

Post by TFDM » Mon Sep 14, 2015 9:10 am

As I've said previously if you want to see what the results of pissing about with short passing at the back go and have a look at our game with Droylsden last season. They tried that and they got themselves in trouble time and time again. If you are getting pressed at the back then you move the ball quickly up field and try and win it higher up the park. Its not rocket science.

I've no problem with the way we play. Its been successful for 3 seasons now. Passing the ball back and fourth in your half won't hurt the opposition. I quite like the way we try to move the ball forward as quickly as possible and play with it in the opponents final third. It works.

Anyway its staggering the number of our fans who can't work out how they want to see the game played. When we pass it and try and be patient you can hear them bellow "Get it forward!". When we get it forward without a bit of success they start shouting "Get it down on the ground and pass it." Unreal.

Like Lo said Saturday was down to too many players having an off day. I don't even buy into what a handful of people said about a lack of effort either. I saw plenty of effort. It was just one of those days where too many people didn't play well enough. We actually created enough chances but our defending wasn't up to scratch and we were punished for it.

As for Halesowen... I thought we played within ourselves a lot of the time and over the course of a season I've no problem with that. We controlled it and never really looked trouble. With a load of fixtures to come I've no issue with us just playing through a game and keeping it in check.

I'm still really cheesed off about Saturday but thats life. You can't win every game. Hopefully we'll bounce back at the weekend.

richymidd
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Re: Hoofball

Post by richymidd » Mon Sep 14, 2015 9:31 am

Don't get me wrong TFDM, I'm not suggesting we get all clever about it. The direct, fast flowing goal is a thing of beauty and I enjoy watching it.

However, let's say Watson's got the ball at RB and he launches something diagonal 60 yards because that's a component of a game plan the boss has given them. Fine. But if there's no pressure on the ball and there's no obvious pass, I still see him launching it. Wouldn't it be better to keep the ball in space, pass it round a bit, retain it and wait for a better opportunity to fling it forward? That's all i'm saying.

Likewise, 3 or 4 times at Halesowen, Turnbull in his own half under a long ball from them, swings his boot, sends it back on the volley and gives them possession again in their half. With no pressure on him, I'd like to think he traps it, keeps it and looks for an option, even sideways?

I rate both of them, simply using them as they were examples that stuck out for me.

1981quaker
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Re: Hoofball

Post by 1981quaker » Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:40 am

MikeinBlack2 wrote:We never lost on Saturday because of the style of football played (hoof ball or otherwise) we lost because we were ineffective in attack and sloppy in defence. We had enough attempts on target to score a couple but simply didn't finish well enough.
Exactly. Couldn't agree more

onewayup
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Re: Hoofball

Post by onewayup » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:41 am

That is totally correct neither team played particularly well but Hyde put their chances in we didn't,hoofball was a tactic played by Hyde ,they had men in behind our defense every goal kick at least 10yards behind,they came with a plan and benefited from that plan that is what I saw.however come Saturday can we put it right, i,d like to think so.

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DarloOnTheUp
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Re: Hoofball

Post by DarloOnTheUp » Mon Sep 14, 2015 1:52 pm

One defeat and everyone loses their minds.

B_Little
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Re: Hoofball

Post by B_Little » Mon Sep 14, 2015 3:17 pm

Good to see I'm not alone. It won't be long before other teams work Darlo out and outplay them. I'm just not sure Darlo will be able to adapt.

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divas
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Re: Hoofball

Post by divas » Mon Sep 14, 2015 3:25 pm

B_Little wrote:Good to see I'm not alone. It won't be long before other teams work Darlo out and outplay them. I'm just not sure Darlo will be able to adapt.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

al_quaker
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Re: Hoofball

Post by al_quaker » Mon Sep 14, 2015 3:26 pm

B_Little wrote:Good to see I'm not alone. It won't be long before other teams work Darlo out and outplay them. I'm just not sure Darlo will be able to adapt.
:roll: We've not been worked out in the last 3 years, and are currently sitting second in the league. :lol:

To my eyes we've generally played a lot more football on the ground this season, so I've literally no idea what you are on about. I can only conclude that it's an overreaction to one defeat.

quakersam
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Re: Hoofball

Post by quakersam » Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:06 pm

B_Little wrote:Good to see I'm not alone. It won't be long before other teams work Darlo out and outplay them. I'm just not sure Darlo will be able to adapt.
It's people like you that get something in to their heads and then can't see anything else but that, for me we've played it on the ground a lot lot more this season, at a higher level than last season. Sometimes you have to go direct and use your outlet as Kev has said, get yourselves high up the pitch and then play football in your opponents half. You'd be the first to fucking whine if we started pissy passy football in our own half and it led to us losing the ball.

You're not sure Darlo will be able to adapt? Tell me how many games we've won this season and where we are in the league... was that not being able to adapt when Blyth went 1 up against us? Or when Rammy parked 10 men behind the ball but we were patient and still managed to get the win.... yeah I thought so
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B_Little
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Re: Hoofball

Post by B_Little » Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:19 pm

Playing in a higher league and Darlo will get found out.

Relying on hoofball and set plays for goals is not great and no I don't expect free flowing footy but do expect a Darlo team to be able to pass the ball between them more than 3 passes before they panic and boot it.

I can't believe the amount of Darlo fans that have accepted this brand of footy.

quakersam
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Re: Hoofball

Post by quakersam » Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:27 pm

B_Little wrote:Playing in a higher league and Darlo will get found out.

Relying on hoofball and set plays for goals is not great and no I don't expect free flowing footy but do expect a Darlo team to be able to pass the ball between them more than 3 passes before they panic and boot it.

I can't believe the amount of Darlo fans that have accepted this brand of footy.
You are absolutely clueless, put the keyboard down you are talking drivel

We'll get found out... P8 W6 L2 - I beg to differ pal, beaten first day of the season and against a very good Workington side, hardly being found out

Relying on hoofball? Erm no we don't actually, have you even seen the highlights this season and looked at how many goals we've scored through passing and moving. So we can't pass the ball 3 times can we not? Wrong again, you only have to watch the extended highlights of one game to see what you've just said is nonsense

If you can't take "this brand" then go and watch the Premier League, the rest of us will get behind the lads as we keep on winning games of football in a new league...
QuakerSam ...Once a Quaker, always a Quaker

AndyPark
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Re: Hoofball

Post by AndyPark » Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:34 pm

F*ck me, we lose ome game and people are booting off.

Didn't see anyone complaining when we won four on the bounce.

carlodarlo
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Re: Hoofball

Post by carlodarlo » Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:45 pm

Please remember B_Little that our players are full time workers and part time players. If they never misplaced a pass and made the right decisions all the time they wouldn't be playing for us! Have a bit of perspective before you take to here to slate them after one defeat to a team that were 2 divisions higher than us last season!

Bogratsteve
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Re: Hoofball

Post by Bogratsteve » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:00 pm

Clearly looking for a bite and a reaction

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