Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Open now for discussion of all things Darlo!

Moderators: botrash, mikkyx, charlie, uncovered

Henley
Posts: 520
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Henley » Thu May 05, 2016 9:21 am


Nigel Batches Beard
Posts: 73
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2015 2:38 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Nigel Batches Beard » Thu May 05, 2016 11:50 am

thats p*ss poor mate :roll:

User avatar
DarloOnTheUp
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:35 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by DarloOnTheUp » Thu May 05, 2016 12:41 pm

:shock:

lo36789
Posts: 8279
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:58 pm
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Liverpool

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by lo36789 » Thu May 05, 2016 2:09 pm

off topic?

Henley
Posts: 520
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Henley » Thu May 05, 2016 2:27 pm

Not at all, for two reasons:

1. It is useful for Darlo fans to know should they try the same.

2. The club has just tied up a commercial arrangement with Virgin Trains and invariably people are judged by who they associate themselves with. This is very poor form from Virgin Trains - just because they're associated with Darlo doesn't mean they shouldn't be called out on it. In fact, it's exactly because they are associated with Darlo that they should be called out on it.

BaronsCourtQuaker
Posts: 767
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 12:52 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by BaronsCourtQuaker » Thu May 05, 2016 2:33 pm

lo36789 wrote:off topic?
and dull.

User avatar
HarrytheQuaker
Posts: 2841
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 3:57 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by HarrytheQuaker » Thu May 05, 2016 2:43 pm

No need for this post...

User avatar
Lawman3
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:47 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Lawman3 » Thu May 05, 2016 2:54 pm

HarrytheQuaker wrote:No need for this post...
Why not? They are our much-heralded new sponsor. They have gained some good publicity, and positive goodwill, from their association with DFC.

We shouldn't let this cloud our judgement when they act like twats.
Never argue with an idiot: The best possible outcome is that you win an argument with an idiot.

User avatar
Makka Pakka
Posts: 1212
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:27 am
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Newton Aycliffe

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Makka Pakka » Thu May 05, 2016 3:25 pm

What is the issue Virgin are trying to prevent? I could understand it if the longer journey was cheaper than the shorter one, but the newspaper article said she paid £10 more than the ticket to/from Darlo would have been.
"At a meeting held at the Grammar School on Friday last - Mr Phillip Wood M.A., in the chair - it was resolved to form an Association Football Club for Darlington and neighbourhood. The opinions of those present were so unanimous as to the desirability of this step, that a committee was formed to complete the organisation of the club, and Mr Craven, 17, Garden Street, was appointed secretary pro tem." - The Northern Echo, Monday 23rd July 1883

tomkaak
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:32 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by tomkaak » Thu May 05, 2016 3:51 pm

So somebody bought a ticket, which was specifically for travel between two destinations with a discount applied on the understanding that they travelled the route that they'd bought and they tried to use it on a different route/station which wasn’t part of the deal.

These tickets are limited, so its worth adding that they bought a discounted ticket and in turn, prevented somebody who legitimately may have wanted to travel the whole journey from getting one.

I'm not saying the person on the barriers was right or wrong, most people would probably have turned the other cheek or let it slide but they have inadvertently abused the discount system and been caught. Not really worthy of running off to the press, is it? The Ts & Cs of that discounted ticket will state how it can be used. I’m sure they wouldn’t have gone to the press praising the staff if they’d let her straight through.

If she had paid £10.00 more than a ticket from 2 stops closer would have cost her, how much extra has the person who could have had her discounted ticket for the whole journey had to pay? It says she paid £33.70 for the ticket they made her buy but the ticket she had was £10 more, so say £43.70. Somebody wanting to do the whole trip today would have paid £57.40 so she has done somebody who could have bought her discounted ticket out of a potential £13.70.

A load of fuss about nothing. They weren’t aware, now they are and they’ve had a financial slap on the wrist along the way. It happens and she was unlucky. I imagine 9 times out of 10 they’d have ignored it but all workplaces have that somebody who is a stickler for the rules.

Henley
Posts: 520
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Henley » Thu May 05, 2016 4:29 pm

tomkaak wrote:So somebody bought a ticket, which was specifically for travel between two destinations with a discount applied on the understanding that they travelled the route that they'd bought and they tried to use it on a different route/station which wasn’t part of the deal.

These tickets are limited, so its worth adding that they bought a discounted ticket and in turn, prevented somebody who legitimately may have wanted to travel the whole journey from getting one.

I'm not saying the person on the barriers was right or wrong, most people would probably have turned the other cheek or let it slide but they have inadvertently abused the discount system and been caught. Not really worthy of running off to the press, is it? The Ts & Cs of that discounted ticket will state how it can be used. I’m sure they wouldn’t have gone to the press praising the staff if they’d let her straight through.

If she had paid £10.00 more than a ticket from 2 stops closer would have cost her, how much extra has the person who could have had her discounted ticket for the whole journey had to pay? It says she paid £33.70 for the ticket they made her buy but the ticket she had was £10 more, so say £43.70. Somebody wanting to do the whole trip today would have paid £57.40 so she has done somebody who could have bought her discounted ticket out of a potential £13.70.

A load of fuss about nothing. They weren’t aware, now they are and they’ve had a financial slap on the wrist along the way. It happens and she was unlucky. I imagine 9 times out of 10 they’d have ignored it but all workplaces have that somebody who is a stickler for the rules.
I don't know what's more unbelievable. The above post or the fact that this person's two previous posts were from 2010 and 2013.

I do seem to draw 'em out of the shadows . . .

GraemeT
Posts: 44
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:30 pm
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by GraemeT » Thu May 05, 2016 4:51 pm

Tomkaak's analysis of the situation is spot on.

The rules are simple. You buy a ticket from A to B, alighting at another station is not permitted. The values of the ticket is irrelevant.

Graeme

User avatar
DarloOnTheUp
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:35 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by DarloOnTheUp » Thu May 05, 2016 5:03 pm

GraemeT wrote:Tomkaak's analysis of the situation is spot on.

The rules are simple. You buy a ticket from A to B, alighting at another station is not permitted. The values of the ticket is irrelevant.

Graeme
So you're saying rules are always correct and should never be challenged, questioned, or changed? :shock:

Henley
Posts: 520
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Henley » Thu May 05, 2016 5:09 pm

GraemeT wrote:Tomkaak's analysis of the situation is spot on.

The rules are simple. You buy a ticket from A to B, alighting at another station is not permitted. The values of the ticket is irrelevant.

Graeme
Yes, we know the situation. It was explained within the news article in the original post.

My reference to 'unbelievable' was the length of the post and that the underlying message would not be that Virgin Trains have made a boo-boo here. The actions of the platform staff are one thing, the refusal to refund on appeal is another.

As the following quote in the article states:
This is terrible PR for the rail company as it makes them look evil. There's lots of work to be done to make the system much simpler and more reasonable.

User avatar
GodAlmighty
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:14 am
Team Supported: Vatican City FC

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by GodAlmighty » Thu May 05, 2016 5:10 pm

DarloOnTheUp wrote:
GraemeT wrote:Tomkaak's analysis of the situation is spot on.

The rules are simple. You buy a ticket from A to B, alighting at another station is not permitted. The values of the ticket is irrelevant.

Graeme
So you're saying rules are always correct and should never be challenged, questioned, or changed? :shock:
Of course. That's the kind of zealous adherence to rules that has perpetuated my relevance for years. And don't you forget it.

God bless.

User avatar
grytters
Posts: 1626
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2009 4:45 pm
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Sheffield

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by grytters » Thu May 05, 2016 6:03 pm

This is nowt to do with Virgin Trains.

It doesn't have anything to do with Virgin Trains East Coast, the Train Operating Company in this instance.


This is a legacy issue from the "terms and conditions of carriage" left over from the old BR days.

Nothing to see here. Move on.
A hyena dancing on the grave of a lion.

User avatar
theoriginalfatcat
Posts: 4141
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:40 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Thu May 05, 2016 6:05 pm

tomkaak wrote:These tickets are limited, so its worth adding that they bought a discounted ticket and in turn, prevented somebody who legitimately may have wanted to travel the whole journey from getting one.

Have you worded that wrong - or made up a fictitious person to suit ?
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

User avatar
DarloOnTheUp
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:35 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by DarloOnTheUp » Thu May 05, 2016 6:17 pm

GodAlmighty wrote:
DarloOnTheUp wrote:
GraemeT wrote:Tomkaak's analysis of the situation is spot on.

The rules are simple. You buy a ticket from A to B, alighting at another station is not permitted. The values of the ticket is irrelevant.

Graeme
So you're saying rules are always correct and should never be challenged, questioned, or changed? :shock:
Of course. That's the kind of zealous adherence to rules that has perpetuated my relevance for years. And don't you forget it.

God bless.
The possibility that you are actually God is more persuasive an argument for the existence of a god than anything I've ever seen from a theist ever.

No wonder they always end up playing the faith card.

Feethams 1966
Posts: 293
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2012 6:13 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Feethams 1966 » Thu May 05, 2016 7:37 pm

My guess is that the top man at Virgin Trains would be horrified if he ever got to hear about what happened to this poor girl and would probably offer her some free tickets to somewhere. He's a good bloke.

User avatar
Gazzadfc
Posts: 158
Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2009 3:17 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Gazzadfc » Thu May 05, 2016 7:52 pm

Please try and remember there will always be 2 sides to a story, no doubt it is being dealt with by the relevant parties.

Henley
Posts: 520
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Henley » Thu May 05, 2016 8:46 pm

grytters wrote:This is nowt to do with Virgin Trains.

It doesn't have anything to do with Virgin Trains East Coast, the Train Operating Company in this instance.


This is a legacy issue from the "terms and conditions of carriage" left over from the old BR days.

Nothing to see here. Move on.
It's got nothing to do with Virgin Trains?

They refused to refund the fine - how is that nothing to do with them? :crazy:

User avatar
theoriginalfatcat
Posts: 4141
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:40 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Thu May 05, 2016 9:15 pm

I take it the fine was levered out of her there and then, if so what would of happened if she had refused to pay?

Anyone .................
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

User avatar
don'tbuythesun
Posts: 1710
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:24 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by don'tbuythesun » Thu May 05, 2016 9:55 pm

Good job no-one ever had a quibble over their mobile when orange were our sponsor....

User avatar
uncovered
Site Admin
Posts: 2196
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:32 am

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by uncovered » Fri May 06, 2016 6:01 am

I think this scenario shows how outdated and antiquated our train system is.

I faced a similar scenario last month when I travelled to London. I was travelling down with my boss and he said where would I like to travel from, I work at Durham but previously have drive to Darlo and got on there, better for when I return. But this time to save hassle I said I would travel with him from Durham.

A couple of weeks before we go he drops out and now I would like to go from Darlo, but knew this rule about having to get on and off where your ticket says. Going down was ok, but coming back on a Friday night, changing trains at Darlo of all places, standing in the platform waiting 30 minutes for my train to Durham was stupid. As I then had to drive back to Darlo, but hey ho I am English and I knew the rules.

Don't get me started on last year when I lost my return to back from kings cross. They made me buy a whole new ticket to allow me to sit in the seat I already bought, £148 for that journey. True customer service! Again it is in the rules so no leg to stand on, unless of course I was on virgin west coast, then I could use their app and be ticketless. Now that is utilising technology to improve the customer journey. But hey ho, let's stick with printing out tickets.

User avatar
don'tbuythesun
Posts: 1710
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:24 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by don'tbuythesun » Fri May 06, 2016 6:59 am

And how did your story not get in the paper...£112 more than this woman's fine!

lo36789
Posts: 8279
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:58 pm
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Liverpool

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by lo36789 » Fri May 06, 2016 7:20 am

but surely this is just supply and demand. Clearly the demand for tickets for her initial journey she bought for was smaller than the demand for the journey she took. Lower demand, same supply (as it was the same train) = cheaper price.

If a TV is on sale for 25% off and that makes the newer model cheaper than the older model you can't just go into the shop pay the money for the newer model at the discounted price and just walk out with the older one...

In all seriousness of course it's stupid - and someone on the gate was clearly having a bad day - once it entered into the procedure then the computer will have defined the rules.

To be honest if she'd gone down the official complaints route changes are she'd have been refunded and got a £10 rail voucher for her trouble instead she went to the papers and will probably get a bit more now.

If any of the players employers did something untoward would it suddenly be relevant to discuss here though?

bga
Posts: 1298
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:18 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by bga » Fri May 06, 2016 9:49 am

This thread is getting out of hand but here goes to try and present some balance....................My daughter lost her purse (it may have been stolen on the Underground) and ticket en route to Euston recently. She explained to Virgin what had happened and they provided a Travel permit WITHOUT charge for he journey North. Also the staff were very helpful as she was very upset about the incident and offered to call various people on her behalf, i.e. Police and myself.

Not all bad news then is it?

Henley
Posts: 520
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by Henley » Fri May 06, 2016 10:19 am

lo36789 wrote:but surely this is just supply and demand. Clearly the demand for tickets for her initial journey she bought for was smaller than the demand for the journey she took. Lower demand, same supply (as it was the same train) = cheaper price.

If a TV is on sale for 25% off and that makes the newer model cheaper than the older model you can't just go into the shop pay the money for the newer model at the discounted price and just walk out with the older one...

In all seriousness of course it's stupid - and someone on the gate was clearly having a bad day - once it entered into the procedure then the computer will have defined the rules.

To be honest if she'd gone down the official complaints route changes are she'd have been refunded and got a £10 rail voucher for her trouble instead she went to the papers and will probably get a bit more now.

If any of the players employers did something untoward would it suddenly be relevant to discuss here though?
Have you actually read the article?

How do you figure that the journey she booked had lower demand than the journey made?

The price she paid for her ticket was greater than if she had paid for the journey she actually took.

m62exile
Posts: 2166
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2009 2:11 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by m62exile » Fri May 06, 2016 10:48 am

uncovered wrote:I think this scenario shows how outdated and antiquated our train system is.

I faced a similar scenario last month when I travelled to London. I was travelling down with my boss and he said where would I like to travel from, I work at Durham but previously have drive to Darlo and got on there, better for when I return. But this time to save hassle I said I would travel with him from Durham.

A couple of weeks before we go he drops out and now I would like to go from Darlo, but knew this rule about having to get on and off where your ticket says. Going down was ok, but coming back on a Friday night, changing trains at Darlo of all places, standing in the platform waiting 30 minutes for my train to Durham was stupid. As I then had to drive back to Darlo, but hey ho I am English and I knew the rules.

Don't get me started on last year when I lost my return to back from kings cross. They made me buy a whole new ticket to allow me to sit in the seat I already bought, £148 for that journey. True customer service! Again it is in the rules so no leg to stand on, unless of course I was on virgin west coast, then I could use their app and be ticketless. Now that is utilising technology to improve the customer journey. But hey ho, let's stick with printing out tickets.
You can use the app on Virgin East Coast now too, I did it last week. Image

spen666
Posts: 1663
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:12 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Virgin Trains - this is very poor on their part

Post by spen666 » Fri May 06, 2016 10:57 am

uncovered wrote:I think this scenario shows how outdated and antiquated our train system is.

I faced a similar scenario last month when I travelled to London. I was travelling down with my boss and he said where would I like to travel from, I work at Durham but previously have drive to Darlo and got on there, better for when I return. But this time to save hassle I said I would travel with him from Durham.

A couple of weeks before we go he drops out and now I would like to go from Darlo, but knew this rule about having to get on and off where your ticket says. Going down was ok, but coming back on a Friday night, changing trains at Darlo of all places, standing in the platform waiting 30 minutes for my train to Durham was stupid. As I then had to drive back to Darlo, but hey ho I am English and I knew the rules.

Don't get me started on last year when I lost my return to back from kings cross. They made me buy a whole new ticket to allow me to sit in the seat I already bought, £148 for that journey. True customer service! Again it is in the rules so no leg to stand on, unless of course I was on virgin west coast, then I could use their app and be ticketless. Now that is utilising technology to improve the customer journey. But hey ho, let's stick with printing out tickets.

Until you find your phone/ tablet etc is flat and you do not have lead/plug to charge it or you have lost or damaged your phone/tablet and so can't prove you have a ticket and curse the fact we don't still print out tickets

Post Reply