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 Post subject: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:15 pm 
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Now we're mathematically safe, I think I can safely put my hands up and say well done to Tommy Wright for the way things have turned round since the beginning of the year. I was very critical when we were on a losing streak, so can only say well done for getting things right.

Now for the summer. We have no strength in depth up front, syers and styche are doing well but after that we really have nothing. That's a may area to strengthen.

I hope Tommy continues with the shape that has served us well rather than trying to go back to a 3 at the back.

I also hope we can shift out some of the players who aren't in our plans, and maybe cash in on one of the players who are attracting interest from higher up, to give us more strength in depth elsewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:23 pm 
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Credit to him for the improved results but let's not get too far ahead of ourselves.

We have a top 10 budget, with some of the league's best players, and we're currently mid-table.

People can point the finger at Gray as much as they like (and he left us in a bad state) but we were mid-table when Wright took over and we're mid-table now.

I'm not going to get too excited about being mathematically safe from relegation when we should have been nowhere near the bottom three in the first place.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:30 pm 
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Don't get me wrong, I still think some wrong decisions were made during that barren spell, but he learned his lessons when they came and that, ultimately, is what saved us.

More to learn too but given how I felt after an hour at leamington today feels pretty good.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:37 pm 
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2-1 down at Leamington there were a number of us fearing the worst including me, and to be safe with 4 games to go really is a miraculous turn around. Phew. Let's not get anywhere as close again to the Evostik.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 8:10 pm 
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Been a great turnaround after a poor start, and I'm sure there are sighs of relief considering where we were around New Year.

Challenge for Wright and White is to build on our form since that game against Leamington next season. I've been impressed with Wright's attitude, and his transfer policy. He could be exactly the right (Wright?) manager for us at this moment in time, if he can take a step forwards on the pitch next season. Obviously the budget is key to that, so hopefully more people can contribute towards the Boost the Budget.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 8:44 pm 
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The first 11 picks itself at the moment, but I expect a few to leave in the summer, Scott, Caton and Brown to name a few. I expect Hunter will be given a chance to prove his fitness.
We have done remarkably well with Just Styche upfront, I have always seen Syers as an attacking midfielder.
So we need a new striker in the summer, a central midfielder to put pressure on Wheatley and Turnbull and a winger to put pressure on Gilles and Thommo.
Of course we need to sort out the goalkeeing situation but that all depends on whether Pears comes back otherwise I think Talbot is worth a look.
After an awful start to his reign we have shown in the last 3 months playoff form it’s just such a shame we have ran out of games.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:49 pm 
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Gillies is a dead cert to leave imo and Caton will stay. Purely because one is under contract and one isn’t. I’d prefer to keep Gillies but we can’t afford to carry them both.

I expect well look to move on 6 and bring in 2/3 to balance the books (GK,CM,ST)
The 6 will depend on who we can move on who isn’t out of contract and will come from the following

Burgess (under contact)
Marrs (under contact)
Brown (under contact)
Scott
Gillies
Portas
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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:59 am 
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Darlogramps wrote:
Credit to him for the improved results but let's not get too far ahead of ourselves.

We have a top 10 budget, with some of the league's best players, and we're currently mid-table.

People can point the finger at Gray as much as they like (and he left us in a bad state) but we were mid-table when Wright took over and we're mid-table now.

I'm not going to get too excited about being mathematically safe from relegation when we should have been nowhere near the bottom three in the first place.

Gray had a bigger budget than Wright. Arguably, he should have had us higher. You can make a lot about budget. We pay over the odds because of where we are. Give our budget to a North West team, you'd have a better squad in my opinion.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 am 
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Gray started with a clean sheet and built his squad over a number of years, lashed out on undeserved wages and contracts before 'stealing' away three first team players. Tommy had to pick up the shattered fragments, cope with long term injuries to first team players, plug some of the holes with loans and signings which were done on a shoestring budget, get the team to play in a new & more attractive system then forge new connection with the fans to repair the rift caused by MG. Now we have secured our place in VNLN for next season, he should be congratulated on a job well done. Now onward & upward, with TW of course!


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 8:51 am 
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Talking of next season, we can now start to look at our opponents - looking forward to Chester away already, I heard someone mention Guiseley yesterday as well, that's relatively local for darlo-based fans.

Altrincham are probably coming back up, and we could be reunited with either Warrington or Nathan cartman and Farsley, if either of those wins the play offs.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:13 am 
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HarryCharltonsCat wrote:
Darlogramps wrote:
Credit to him for the improved results but let's not get too far ahead of ourselves.

We have a top 10 budget, with some of the league's best players, and we're currently mid-table.

People can point the finger at Gray as much as they like (and he left us in a bad state) but we were mid-table when Wright took over and we're mid-table now.

I'm not going to get too excited about being mathematically safe from relegation when we should have been nowhere near the bottom three in the first place.

Gray had a bigger budget than Wright. Arguably, he should have had us higher. You can make a lot about budget. We pay over the odds because of where we are. Give our budget to a North West team, you'd have a better squad in my opinion.


Is this the default position when it comes to TW? We can't any serious discussion about him without the conversation turning to MG. I can't wait for next season, because no one can use the MG excuse. TW will 'own' the team, for good or bad.

Even with a reduced playing budget, it's still more competitive than plenty of sides in the division. As I said, we shouldn't have been anywhere near relegation, and celebrating mathematical safety (which thankfully few fans have done) is a silly thing to do.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:14 am 
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Well done Tommy, even grudging support from Gramps. I'm delighted you proved the doubters wrong. Alan White needs to get some credit as well, as he turns our defence from chumps to champs. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:24 am 
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jjljks wrote:
Gray started with a clean sheet and built his squad over a number of years, lashed out on undeserved wages and contracts before 'stealing' away three first team players. Tommy had to pick up the shattered fragments, cope with long term injuries to first team players, plug some of the holes with loans and signings which were done on a shoestring budget, get the team to play in a new & more attractive system then forge new connection with the fans to repair the rift caused by MG. Now we have secured our place in VNLN for next season, he should be congratulated on a job well done. Now onward & upward, with TW of course!


See it's this kind of revisionist nonsense that does my head in.

TW did not have a "shoestring" budget. MG did not "steal" away players (did TW steal away players from Nuneaton?) Every manager has to cope with injuries. And "shattered fragments"? Do me a favour.

TW took over a side in mid-table, with a mid-table budget and has taken them to mid-table, via the bottom three. He's got a lot right and has done a good job since January. He needed to after making a series of errors when he took over.

But let's not be rewriting history or exaggerating what's happened because of our dislike of MG.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:34 am 
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I’ve very much enjoyed this season.

The ramifications of ‘Seatgate” have lingered on meaning since then we’ve very much seen a titanic battle of good verses evil played out - like Lord of The Rings, or similar success twaddle!

The good of us (the fans/owners/protectors of the badge) verses the evil of others, others who have their own secret agenda and wish to take over by using the lure of money and false promises.

We haven’t had promotion chasing excitement like in previous years but we have had genuine relegation concerns which have also been exciting but in a stressful sort of way. Now that’s sorted we are in a better position than this time last year - we won’t be as high up in the league, but the whole club just seems happier and more ‘as one’ and that benefits us all.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 11:02 am 
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divas wrote:
Gillies is a dead cert to leave imo and Caton will stay. Purely because one is under contract and one isn’t. I’d prefer to keep Gillies but we can’t afford to carry them both.

I expect well look to move on 6 and bring in 2/3 to balance the books (GK,CM,ST)
The 6 will depend on who we can move on who isn’t out of contract and will come from the following

Burgess (under contact)
Marrs (under contact)
Brown (under contact)
Scott
Gillies
Portas
Hunter


I will be furious if Gillies was moved on in the summer and Caton & Mills remained in the squad. Both have actually shown very, very little this season and I think a lot of people would be surprised with Gillies' output despite a hot and cold season (highest assister).


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 11:16 am 
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Well done Tommy and Alan - safety achieved! I had my doubts that they'd be able to turn our midseason slump around but a decent run from February has alleviated this. Now is the real test, a full preseason and a chance to put a proper stamp on the playing squad, hopefully a continuation of the positivity and general upward form. :thumbup:

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 11:44 am 
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Darlofan97 wrote:
divas wrote:
Gillies is a dead cert to leave imo and Caton will stay. Purely because one is under contract and one isn’t. I’d prefer to keep Gillies but we can’t afford to carry them both.

I expect well look to move on 6 and bring in 2/3 to balance the books (GK,CM,ST)
The 6 will depend on who we can move on who isn’t out of contract and will come from the following

Burgess (under contact)
Marrs (under contact)
Brown (under contact)
Scott
Gillies
Portas
Hunter


I will be furious if Gillies was moved on in the summer and Caton & Mills remained in the squad. Both have actually shown very, very little this season and I think a lot of people would be surprised with Gillies' output despite a hot and cold season (highest assister).


However Caton and Mills have contracts but Gillies is up. With a budget reduction I can't see a way that Gillies will stay unless someone comes in for Caton and Mills.

Gillies scores about 8/10 per season and does assist a few also which puts his output at more currently than Mills/Caton.

Just have to see what Tommy does on this one, I have the mindset that whoever goes, goes and so be it. Time and squad move on.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:19 pm 
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super_les_mcjannet wrote:
Darlofan97 wrote:
divas wrote:
Gillies is a dead cert to leave imo and Caton will stay. Purely because one is under contract and one isn’t. I’d prefer to keep Gillies but we can’t afford to carry them both.

I expect well look to move on 6 and bring in 2/3 to balance the books (GK,CM,ST)
The 6 will depend on who we can move on who isn’t out of contract and will come from the following

Burgess (under contact)
Marrs (under contact)
Brown (under contact)
Scott
Gillies
Portas
Hunter


I will be furious if Gillies was moved on in the summer and Caton & Mills remained in the squad. Both have actually shown very, very little this season and I think a lot of people would be surprised with Gillies' output despite a hot and cold season (highest assister).


However Caton and Mills have contracts but Gillies is up. With a budget reduction I can't see a way that Gillies will stay unless someone comes in for Caton and Mills.

Gillies scores about 8/10 per season and does assist a few also which puts his output at more currently than Mills/Caton.

Just have to see what Tommy does on this one, I have the mindset that whoever goes, goes and so be it. Time and squad move on.

Signed until end of next season according to this?

http://darlingtonfootballclub.co.uk/jos ... -contract/

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:21 pm 
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Believed to be a one year option and Gillies is out of contract if we don't take it up.

Guess we will find out for sure sooner or later.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:27 pm 
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Ah right - difficult decision then. One of the most talented players in the squad, but also one of the most inconsistent, and no doubt one of the highest paid too. Like you say unless people come in for Caton and/or Mills it's difficult to see him being here next year what with a budget cut

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:40 pm 
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Darlogramps wrote:
jjljks wrote:
Gray started with a clean sheet and built his squad over a number of years, lashed out on undeserved wages and contracts before 'stealing' away three first team players. Tommy had to pick up the shattered fragments, cope with long term injuries to first team players, plug some of the holes with loans and signings which were done on a shoestring budget, get the team to play in a new & more attractive system then forge new connection with the fans to repair the rift caused by MG. Now we have secured our place in VNLN for next season, he should be congratulated on a job well done. Now onward & upward, with TW of course!


See it's this kind of revisionist nonsense that does my head in.

TW did not have a "shoestring" budget. MG did not "steal" away players (did TW steal away players from Nuneaton?) Every manager has to cope with injuries. And "shattered fragments"? Do me a favour.

TW took over a side in mid-table, with a mid-table budget and has taken them to mid-table, via the bottom three. He's got a lot right and has done a good job since January. He needed to after making a series of errors when he took over.

But let's not be rewriting history or exaggerating what's happened because of our dislike of MG.

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You’re sugar-coating the situation when Wright first arrived. “Mid-table” doesn’t describe the freefall prior to that and which continued


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:16 pm 
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al_quaker wrote:
Ah right - difficult decision then. One of the most talented players in the squad, but also one of the most inconsistent, and no doubt one of the highest paid too. Like you say unless people come in for Caton and/or Mills it's difficult to see him being here next year what with a budget cut


If Gillies played like he did yesterday every week he would be worth pushing the boat out for. However he does seem to only play well when the pitches aren't swamps. Its a hard decision to make for Wright. I can see Mills being the one that is told to try and find somewhere else.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:27 pm 
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loan_star wrote:
al_quaker wrote:
Ah right - difficult decision then. One of the most talented players in the squad, but also one of the most inconsistent, and no doubt one of the highest paid too. Like you say unless people come in for Caton and/or Mills it's difficult to see him being here next year what with a budget cut


If Gillies played like he did yesterday every week he would be worth pushing the boat out for. However he does seem to only play well when the pitches aren't swamps. Its a hard decision to make for Wright. I can see Mills being the one that is told to try and find somewhere else.

And yet Wright was quite staunch in his defence of Mills at the recent fans forum. Without knowing the numbers game TW will have to play for next season’s squad size, it could be a test of his abilities to “release” some players still under contract


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:28 pm 
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Looking back I reckon Caton’s Introduction at Leamington was the spark that reignited our season. We were looking down and out...2-1 down against 10 men. The kid was electrifying down that left wing and set up our winner. TW said to us after the game that he’s a confidence player and needed his arse kicking as the nicey nicey stuff hadn’t worked. It worked that day. He looked to be a shoe-in from then on but was promptly injured v Blyth after again assisting.
Gillies has to be one of the most talented midfielders in this league...on his day he looks too good. I’d keep both if possible.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:36 pm 
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QuakerPete wrote:
Darlogramps wrote:
jjljks wrote:
Gray started with a clean sheet and built his squad over a number of years, lashed out on undeserved wages and contracts before 'stealing' away three first team players. Tommy had to pick up the shattered fragments, cope with long term injuries to first team players, plug some of the holes with loans and signings which were done on a shoestring budget, get the team to play in a new & more attractive system then forge new connection with the fans to repair the rift caused by MG. Now we have secured our place in VNLN for next season, he should be congratulated on a job well done. Now onward & upward, with TW of course!


See it's this kind of revisionist nonsense that does my head in.

TW did not have a "shoestring" budget. MG did not "steal" away players (did TW steal away players from Nuneaton?) Every manager has to cope with injuries. And "shattered fragments"? Do me a favour.

TW took over a side in mid-table, with a mid-table budget and has taken them to mid-table, via the bottom three. He's got a lot right and has done a good job since January. He needed to after making a series of errors when he took over.

But let's not be rewriting history or exaggerating what's happened because of our dislike of MG.

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You’re sugar-coating the situation when Wright first arrived. “Mid-table” doesn’t describe the freefall prior to that and which continued


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Without wanting to restart the old arguments, I would say you're exaggerating.

I don't think we were in freefall. A bad run yes, freefall not so much. Would Gray have taken us into the relegation zone? I don't think so. No way I can prove that of course, but I don't think it would have happened.

Taking three months to establish a formation and system that suited his squad was poor from Wright. As was persisting with a style of play which didn't suit the team. That exacerbated a bad situation. But I'm glad he's turned things around.



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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:10 pm 
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We have to be pragmatic with our squad - we may not get offers for contacted players that we’d prefer to move on, especially if they’re on decent money.

Rumour had it a while back that South Shields were interested in Gillies, and that may come to fruition in the summer.

With regard to Gray ‘stealing’ players, I’d argue he did us a huge favour as we got decent fees when we desperately needed the money and we’ve ended up with arguably better replacement on less money.

Bartlett has been more than adequately replaced by Pears, whilst Ferguson was a loss as a left winger, Gray preferred him a left back where O’Hanlon has been a fantastic replacement.

Beck was sensational for us last year, but became a victim of his own success both tactically and with referees, and needed time to recover from injuries; Styche has a better all round game, suits us better longer term, but is less clinical in front of goal.


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:26 pm 
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Darlogramps wrote:
QuakerPete wrote:
Darlogramps wrote:
jjljks wrote:
Gray started with a clean sheet and built his squad over a number of years, lashed out on undeserved wages and contracts before 'stealing' away three first team players. Tommy had to pick up the shattered fragments, cope with long term injuries to first team players, plug some of the holes with loans and signings which were done on a shoestring budget, get the team to play in a new & more attractive system then forge new connection with the fans to repair the rift caused by MG. Now we have secured our place in VNLN for next season, he should be congratulated on a job well done. Now onward & upward, with TW of course!


See it's this kind of revisionist nonsense that does my head in.

TW did not have a "shoestring" budget. MG did not "steal" away players (did TW steal away players from Nuneaton?) Every manager has to cope with injuries. And "shattered fragments"? Do me a favour.

TW took over a side in mid-table, with a mid-table budget and has taken them to mid-table, via the bottom three. He's got a lot right and has done a good job since January. He needed to after making a series of errors when he took over.

But let's not be rewriting history or exaggerating what's happened because of our dislike of MG.

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You’re sugar-coating the situation when Wright first arrived. “Mid-table” doesn’t describe the freefall prior to that and which continued


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Without wanting to restart the old arguments, I would say you're exaggerating.

I don't think we were in freefall. A bad run yes, freefall not so much. Would Gray have taken us into the relegation zone? I don't think so. No way I can prove that of course, but I don't think it would have happened.

Taking three months to establish a formation and system that suited his squad was poor from Wright. As was persisting with a style of play which didn't suit the team. That exacerbated a bad situation. But I'm glad he's turned things around.



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I don't know - these days we all expect instant results from a new manager but three months to get to grips with a new job doesn't seem that unreasonable.

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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:30 pm 
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Darlogramps wrote:
QuakerPete wrote:
Darlogramps wrote:
jjljks wrote:
Gray started with a clean sheet and built his squad over a number of years, lashed out on undeserved wages and contracts before 'stealing' away three first team players. Tommy had to pick up the shattered fragments, cope with long term injuries to first team players, plug some of the holes with loans and signings which were done on a shoestring budget, get the team to play in a new & more attractive system then forge new connection with the fans to repair the rift caused by MG. Now we have secured our place in VNLN for next season, he should be congratulated on a job well done. Now onward & upward, with TW of course!


See it's this kind of revisionist nonsense that does my head in.

TW did not have a "shoestring" budget. MG did not "steal" away players (did TW steal away players from Nuneaton?) Every manager has to cope with injuries. And "shattered fragments"? Do me a favour.

TW took over a side in mid-table, with a mid-table budget and has taken them to mid-table, via the bottom three. He's got a lot right and has done a good job since January. He needed to after making a series of errors when he took over.

But let's not be rewriting history or exaggerating what's happened because of our dislike of MG.

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You’re sugar-coating the situation when Wright first arrived. “Mid-table” doesn’t describe the freefall prior to that and which continued


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Without wanting to restart the old arguments, I would say you're exaggerating.

I don't think we were in freefall. A bad run yes, freefall not so much. Would Gray have taken us into the relegation zone? I don't think so. No way I can prove that of course, but I don't think it would have happened.

Taking three months to establish a formation and system that suited his squad was poor from Wright. As was persisting with a style of play which didn't suit the team. That exacerbated a bad situation. But I'm glad he's turned things around.



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Depends on your definitions of freefall v bad run - First 4 games with 10 points against next 11 games with 8 points. No evidence that Gray was ever going to rescue that.
So many imponderables that TW had to deal with when he joined - yes, shame it took a while to sort out. The squad was in transition anyway in my opinion and TW’s signings beats Gray’s summer signings hands down. Wright has a task on his hands still in order to sort the squad out.
That’s not to denigrate Gray’s previous achievements


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:31 pm 
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Gramps - you pulled the trigger too fast on TW, you now are so begrudging about any achievements that it reads as though you’re more interested in being proved right than how well we do.

As we all know, eventually TW will hit a bad run and no doubt get fired as that’s the way football works but that could be 6 month’s or 10 years away so you might as well enjoy the ride for now and enjoy the progress by getting behind him rather than looking to repeat your opinion on his first three months.

When it comes to it you can highlight your previous threads then and we’ll all agree that you were right then!


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 Post subject: Re: Well done Tommy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:27 pm 
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m62exile wrote:
Gramps - you pulled the trigger too fast on TW, you now are so begrudging about any achievements that it reads as though you’re more interested in being proved right than how well we do.

As we all know, eventually TW will hit a bad run and no doubt get fired as that’s the way football works but that could be 6 month’s or 10 years away so you might as well enjoy the ride for now and enjoy the progress by getting behind him rather than looking to repeat your opinion on his first three months.

When it comes to it you can highlight your previous threads then and we’ll all agree that you were right then!


My first contribution in this thread is literally "credit to TW" and I've repeatedly said he's done well since January (ironically since doing the things I said he needed to do - stop chopping and changing and settling on a system to suit the squad he had).

He's had three good months and three bad months - you're essentially saying I should only focus on the good stuff. I'm sorry but if we're looking at TW's impact as a whole (which is what we're doing in this thread), the bad stuff has to be included, however much you dislike it. Yes I'm sceptical about his abilities as a manager but that doesn't mean I'm not allowed to point out his mistakes.

I'd argue you're jumping the gun by talking about TW's 'achievements'. He's not achieved anything other than taking a mid-table team into mid-table with a mid-table budget (accounting for the mid-season reduction). That's not begrudging, I just don't think it's anything to be overly impressed with.

To say I'd prefer to be proved right than have us do well is a pathetic cheap shot.

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Last edited by Darlogramps on Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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