Styche and Ainge

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Darlo_Pete » Mon Sep 10, 2018 1:37 pm

HarrytheQuaker wrote:
Darlo_Pete wrote:Saw Saunders goal at Ashton Utd, which was just a tap in, all be it under pressure from a couple of Sutton Utd players. I have been fairly critical of Saunders for a while now, but I have to admit he has improved considerably at the start of this season. But Styche is more of a natural finisher and so should get the nod ahead of Saunders.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by loan_star » Mon Sep 10, 2018 7:35 pm

HarryCharltonsCat wrote:
loan_star wrote:Saunders is work in progress and isn't ready to lead the line every week. If we go to Southport and expect the same results with him then chances are we would end up disappointed. Its not fair to Saunders to keep him in when the likes of Styche is available, the pressure on him is big enough without having Styche breathing down his neck from the sidelines.
Styche is proven at this level and if he's available he plays IMO.
So when will Harvey be ready? He's not a kid anymore. He won't get better without games, and after a good performance like yesterday's, won't his confidence be sky high for next week? Like Styche himself, I say leave the team alone.
Well he's not ready week in week out just yet. He's made great progress lately but too much expectation could knock him back.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by HarryCharltonsCat » Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:08 pm

loan_star wrote:
HarryCharltonsCat wrote:
loan_star wrote:Saunders is work in progress and isn't ready to lead the line every week. If we go to Southport and expect the same results with him then chances are we would end up disappointed. Its not fair to Saunders to keep him in when the likes of Styche is available, the pressure on him is big enough without having Styche breathing down his neck from the sidelines.
Styche is proven at this level and if he's available he plays IMO.
So when will Harvey be ready? He's not a kid anymore. He won't get better without games, and after a good performance like yesterday's, won't his confidence be sky high for next week? Like Styche himself, I say leave the team alone.
Well he's not ready week in week out just yet. He's made great progress lately but too much expectation could knock him back.
Surely he is ready for 2 games in a row, or he's wasting his time.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Geordie Quaker » Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:02 am

jjljks wrote:Not sure how bad the jet lag is from Lichtenstein, but Gib (& Styche) failed to score whilst the squad players took their chances & makes it a tough decision for TW as who to leave out.
So if Kane doesn't bag for England does Pochettino have to consider leaving him out?

International form is irrelevant (especially in the context of a nation like Gibraltar). Styche has to start, full stop. This whole mantra of "never change a winning team" only applies if you do not have players who can improve it.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by onewayup » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:04 am

Geordie Quaker wrote:
jjljks wrote:Not sure how bad the jet lag is from Lichtenstein, but Gib (& Styche) failed to score whilst the squad players took their chances & makes it a tough decision for TW as who to leave out.
So if Kane doesn't bag for England does Pochettino have to consider leaving him out?

International form is irrelevant (especially in the context of a nation like Gibraltar). Styche has to start, full stop. This whole mantra of "never change a winning team" only applies if you do not have players who can improve it.
Surely this is what happened on Saturday an improvement on previous games and winning against a top three team, an improvement wouldn't you say, so yes keep the faith in the team that did improve Saturday. Styche and ainge can come on from the bench if it's not going well, at least you give the lads encouragement for Saturday, s performance. My opinion anyway, right or wrong.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:32 am

Unless Styche is tired or injured then to put him on the bench and play Saunders is just silly - and won't happen.

But this shouldn't be a problem. Saunders is a young player at the start of his career who is just starting to show everyone that he can produce. He can keep on learning and take his chances when they come along. Hopefully he can be happy that things are going well

Styche however (who hasn't been dropped through lack of form or injury) is usually our best player,captain and gets paid as such. We need him to be starting this game.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by 50 years » Tue Sep 11, 2018 10:33 am

I think I am one who would stick with the team with no changes. Thought it was excellent that Styche said on his Twitter account (as per mentioned earlier in thread - assume it is true as I am not on twitter), that he didn't think you should change the team - that is a captain thinking of the team before himself. The reason I would not change it are:-
Guys deserve opportunity to prove it was not one off
Confidence will be high
Fantastic players to come off the bench if needed.

TW is in a difficult position, if he changes the team or not and they lose some of our key board warriers will say he should have done the opposite - easy in hindsight ofcourse.

Whatever the year brings we need to get behind the team - we dont have the money to chop and change or bring in many more players (remember we may have to raise another £80k for budget next year just to maintain what we have or a lot more if promoted).
I personally would prefer a gòod cup run than promotion so we can get money behind us this year(obviously prefer Good cup runs and promotion ;) )

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Spyman » Tue Sep 11, 2018 10:41 am

onewayup wrote:
Geordie Quaker wrote:
jjljks wrote:Not sure how bad the jet lag is from Lichtenstein, but Gib (& Styche) failed to score whilst the squad players took their chances & makes it a tough decision for TW as who to leave out.
So if Kane doesn't bag for England does Pochettino have to consider leaving him out?

International form is irrelevant (especially in the context of a nation like Gibraltar). Styche has to start, full stop. This whole mantra of "never change a winning team" only applies if you do not have players who can improve it.
Surely this is what happened on Saturday an improvement on previous games and winning against a top three team, an improvement wouldn't you say, so yes keep the faith in the team that did improve Saturday. Styche and ainge can come on from the bench if it's not going well, at least you give the lads encouragement for Saturday, s performance. My opinion anyway, right or wrong.
So are we putting the improvement on Saturday entirely down to Saunders playing instead of Styche?

There were several changes from previous games. Firstly, the formation changed with Syers coming in and giving us five in midfield. Wheatley returned, who most seem to say changes us entirely in terms of midfield mobility. Hughes (partly the cause of lack of midfield mobility in Wheatley's absence) dropped into central defence and got man of the match. O'Hanlon I think also returned to the side (or was he back the week prior)?

Anyway, there were clearly a number of contributing factors to our improvement - reversing one of those (and probably, on by all accounts, the least significant of those changes) isn't necessarily going to undo all of the improvement.

Should we be discussing whether Ainge comes back in for Burn (or Hughes) as much as we are discussing Styche/Saunders? For me that's probably a tougher call.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by divas » Tue Sep 11, 2018 11:35 am

If Ainge is fit we all know that both him and Styche will come into the team in forward areas now that we’ve got a few defenders back. I’d imagine it will be Ainge in for Saunders and Styche in for Syers probably utilising Styche wider/deeper as he has been at times this season. I don’t believe it’s the right thing to do but I’m sure it’ll will happen

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by JE93 » Tue Sep 11, 2018 11:36 am

Spyman wrote:
onewayup wrote:
Geordie Quaker wrote:
jjljks wrote:Not sure how bad the jet lag is from Lichtenstein, but Gib (& Styche) failed to score whilst the squad players took their chances & makes it a tough decision for TW as who to leave out.
So if Kane doesn't bag for England does Pochettino have to consider leaving him out?

International form is irrelevant (especially in the context of a nation like Gibraltar). Styche has to start, full stop. This whole mantra of "never change a winning team" only applies if you do not have players who can improve it.
Surely this is what happened on Saturday an improvement on previous games and winning against a top three team, an improvement wouldn't you say, so yes keep the faith in the team that did improve Saturday. Styche and ainge can come on from the bench if it's not going well, at least you give the lads encouragement for Saturday, s performance. My opinion anyway, right or wrong.
So are we putting the improvement on Saturday entirely down to Saunders playing instead of Styche?

There were several changes from previous games. Firstly, the formation changed with Syers coming in and giving us five in midfield. Wheatley returned, who most seem to say changes us entirely in terms of midfield mobility. Hughes (partly the cause of lack of midfield mobility in Wheatley's absence) dropped into central defence and got man of the match. O'Hanlon I think also returned to the side (or was he back the week prior)?

Anyway, there were clearly a number of contributing factors to our improvement - reversing one of those (and probably, on by all accounts, the least significant of those changes) isn't necessarily going to undo all of the improvement.

Should we be discussing whether Ainge comes back in for Burn (or Hughes) as much as we are discussing Styche/Saunders? For me that's probably a tougher call.
I think that's pretty accurate Spyman. From my point of view. I think it's far more important that we stick to 4-5-1 / 4-2-3-1 than the individual we put up front. When they're all fit we have one of the best midfield in the league.

On the point of strikers we have 3 very different options. Styche will hold the ball and run at defenders. Ainge as the Target man who wins his headers and Saunders as the speed merchant to run in behind. All I'll be useful against different defences and times and situations in games. For me though I think Styche is the best mix of getting involved in play and spearheading the attack.

Credit must go to Harvey Saunders though, he's shown great improvement since coming back for preseason. His goal against Ashton came from his anticipation of the keeper spilling the shot similar with his goal against Telford where he anticipated Syers winning the flick on. This is a step on from how he was reacting to events last year and means that his pace is put to best use and he will get to the ball first and score more goals.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:41 pm

JE93 wrote:Credit must go to Harvey Saunders though, he's shown great improvement since coming back for preseason. His goal against Ashton came from his anticipation of the keeper spilling the shot similar with his goal against Telford where he anticipated Syers winning the flick on. This is a step on from how he was reacting to events last year and means that his pace is put to best use and he will get to the ball first and score more goals.
Agreed :clap: If Harvey keeps on going like this he'll have a good future. I enjoy watching our younger home grown players break into the team.

Credit also to Hughes, what a game he had on Saturday - and I'm wondering why we don't let him have a go with a few free kicks? As he's such a good placer of the ball.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by beatroute66 » Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:43 pm

For Saturday, I'd probably go with:

- Maddison

- Trotman
- O'Hanlon
- Hughes
- Galbraith

- Wheatley
- Elliott
- Nicholson
- Syers
- Thompson

- Styche

Sub - Ainge
Sub - Saunders
Sub - Henshall
Sub - Burn
Sub - Bancroft


It's all about formations, isn't it? With a 4-4-2 Styche and Ainge up top is a bit of no-brainer, but we've always looked better at 4-5-1 under Tommy in my opinion and I really like the idea of Thommo, Nicholson and Syers swimming around Styche (or Ainge, for that matter) when we're pressing, but that does create a problem around fitting both of those two in.

I've always been 50/50 on Saunders, but he did really well on Saturday and (as a friend of mine rightly points out), he'd really benefit from a run of games in a system that plays to his strengths - that's 4-5-1, allowing him to use his pace down the flanks when we attack, as against a 4-4-2 where he's relying on 2nd balls from Styche or Ainge when we go a lot more direct.

Syers was excellent on Saturday - I'm a big fan of his - and I'd feel it harsh on him if we dropped him. As Tommy said after the game, he knew when to drop into midfield and he knew when to support Saunders. Let's be honest, if it wasn't for injuries and career choices, Syers would be Football League and not playing at our level.

Likewise Hughes was top class at CB, and whilst Burn probably had one of his better games for us, I'd like to see what Tez and Hughes can do together for now. If we're thinking that's harsh on Burn, we can potentially start with Burn in the XI and Tez on the bench.

Either way, it's another nail in the Dom Collins' coffin, especially when Vaulks comes back.

Let's see what Tommy thinks...

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by eddie-rowles » Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:23 pm

For me keep the same eleven, Saunders pace kept most of the Telford back four hemmed in they were worried leaving space for Syers who has to start, Styche is not going to worry a defender for pace it is not his game of power and skill. He can come on off the bench along with Ainge (if fit) which is a fantastic pair to have. The Peterlee Pele to keep the armband .

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by loan_star » Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:26 pm

HarryCharltonsCat wrote:
loan_star wrote:
HarryCharltonsCat wrote:
loan_star wrote:Saunders is work in progress and isn't ready to lead the line every week. If we go to Southport and expect the same results with him then chances are we would end up disappointed. Its not fair to Saunders to keep him in when the likes of Styche is available, the pressure on him is big enough without having Styche breathing down his neck from the sidelines.
Styche is proven at this level and if he's available he plays IMO.
So when will Harvey be ready? He's not a kid anymore. He won't get better without games, and after a good performance like yesterday's, won't his confidence be sky high for next week? Like Styche himself, I say leave the team alone.
Well he's not ready week in week out just yet. He's made great progress lately but too much expectation could knock him back.
Surely he is ready for 2 games in a row, or he's wasting his time.
With the added pressure of Styche and possibly Ainge on the bench waiting to come on? Not fair on the lad. His Darlo career so far has been plenty of effort with not much end product. Expecting him to turn the corner so quickly is asking too much too soon in my opinion.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by PierremontQuaker03 » Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:37 pm

beatroute66 wrote:For Saturday, I'd probably go with:

- Maddison

- Trotman
- O'Hanlon
- Hughes
- Galbraith

- Wheatley
- Elliott
- Nicholson
- Syers
- Thompson

- Styche

Sub - Ainge
Sub - Saunders
Sub - Henshall
Sub - Burn
Sub - Bancroft


It's all about formations, isn't it? With a 4-4-2 Styche and Ainge up top is a bit of no-brainer, but we've always looked better at 4-5-1 under Tommy in my opinion and I really like the idea of Thommo, Nicholson and Syers swimming around Styche (or Ainge, for that matter) when we're pressing, but that does create a problem around fitting both of those two in.

I've always been 50/50 on Saunders, but he did really well on Saturday and (as a friend of mine rightly points out), he'd really benefit from a run of games in a system that plays to his strengths - that's 4-5-1, allowing him to use his pace down the flanks when we attack, as against a 4-4-2 where he's relying on 2nd balls from Styche or Ainge when we go a lot more direct.

Syers was excellent on Saturday - I'm a big fan of his - and I'd feel it harsh on him if we dropped him. As Tommy said after the game, he knew when to drop into midfield and he knew when to support Saunders. Let's be honest, if it wasn't for injuries and career choices, Syers would be Football League and not playing at our level.

Likewise Hughes was top class at CB, and whilst Burn probably had one of his better games for us, I'd like to see what Tez and Hughes can do together for now. If we're thinking that's harsh on Burn, we can potentially start with Burn in the XI and Tez on the bench.

Either way, it's another nail in the Dom Collins' coffin, especially when Vaulks comes back.

Let's see what Tommy thinks...
I dont see any rush in bringing Tez back into the team unless 100% fit, same with Ainge.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Allan Quatermain » Tue Sep 11, 2018 6:02 pm

beatroute66 wrote:For Saturday, I'd probably go with:

- Maddison

- Trotman
- O'Hanlon
- Hughes
- Galbraith

- Wheatley
- Elliott
- Nicholson
- Syers
- Thompson

- Styche

Sub - Ainge
Sub - Saunders
Sub - Henshall
Sub - Burn
Sub - Bancroft


It's all about formations, isn't it? With a 4-4-2 Styche and Ainge up top is a bit of no-brainer, but we've always looked better at 4-5-1 under Tommy in my opinion and I really like the idea of Thommo, Nicholson and Syers swimming around Styche (or Ainge, for that matter) when we're pressing, but that does create a problem around fitting both of those two in.

I've always been 50/50 on Saunders, but he did really well on Saturday and (as a friend of mine rightly points out), he'd really benefit from a run of games in a system that plays to his strengths - that's 4-5-1, allowing him to use his pace down the flanks when we attack, as against a 4-4-2 where he's relying on 2nd balls from Styche or Ainge when we go a lot more direct.

Syers was excellent on Saturday - I'm a big fan of his - and I'd feel it harsh on him if we dropped him. As Tommy said after the game, he knew when to drop into midfield and he knew when to support Saunders. Let's be honest, if it wasn't for injuries and career choices, Syers would be Football League and not playing at our level.

Likewise Hughes was top class at CB, and whilst Burn probably had one of his better games for us, I'd like to see what Tez and Hughes can do together for now. If we're thinking that's harsh on Burn, we can potentially start with Burn in the XI and Tez on the bench.

Either way, it's another nail in the Dom Collins' coffin, especially when Vaulks comes back.

Let's see what Tommy thinks...
I guess it depends what TW has been telling the fringe players during the week. If he's been saying "You'll get your chance. Take it and you'll keep your place", then he needs to either leave HS in the starting lineup or have a difficult chat with him which could mean he loses some credibility by not sticking to his word.

But granted, at this stage Styche is the number one striker.

As for the defence, we've had little enough opportunities of picking the same back 4 in consecutive weeks and as Saturday's defensive performance was immense, I'd be leaving it the same.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Craig09 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:21 am

Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Craig09 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:21 am

Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Spyman » Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:49 am

Craig09 wrote:Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him
The number of goals he's scored since converting to a striker suggest you're wrong.
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We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by don'tbuythesun » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:18 am

50 years, from one old git to possibly another, you don't have to be "on" Twitter. You can just search normally and have a look. It's often tripe so I'm not "on" it either!

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by jjljks » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:37 am

Extract from a recent posting:-

[/quote]Either way, it's another nail in the Dom Collins' coffin, especially when Vaulks comes back.

Let's see what Tommy thinks...[/quote]

Yes, it has gone very quiet on the Collins front. And Caton too, come to that. Anyone got news on either? :?:

As a club of limited means, we cannot afford to carry players who don't contribute to the team.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:08 am

jjljks wrote:Extract from a recent posting:-
Either way, it's another nail in the Dom Collins' coffin, especially when Vaulks comes back.

Let's see what Tommy thinks...[/quote]

Yes, it has gone very quiet on the Collins front. And Caton too, come to that. Anyone got news on either? :?:

As a club of limited means, we cannot afford to carry players who don't contribute to the team.[/quote]

Collins has a genuine injury, not sure how long he could be out for but would expect when fit again he will be available for selection.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by jjljks » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:41 am

Thanks, Les! Much appreciated

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by beatroute66 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:18 am

No issue with the same back four this Saturday based on last Saturday, even if Tez is fully fit.

Longer term, though, I'd like to see Burn really have to fight for his place as I can see a lot of potential in pairing Tez and Hughes at CH.

My point on Collins was more so overall. Relations between him and TW haven't been great of late, and I noticed that TW said something along of the lines of "It isn't easy when you have the likes of Styche, Ainge and Galbraith not available - big names!" on Saturday evening. No mention of Collins (who is also injured/not available).

Perhaps we do keep the same XI on Saturday, with Ainge, Styche, Tez, etc, on the bench. They would deserve it and I agree re: the point made above that if Saunders has scored/put in a real shift, only to be dropped, that it wouldn't do him any favours.

Main thing is we have strong options again off the back of one of our best results of the season. Complete contrast to the lead up to last Saturday's game (on both counts).

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by beatroute66 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:20 am

Craig09 wrote:Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him
But Ainge's game is nothing to do with pace? :think:

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by shawry » Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:21 am

beatroute66 wrote:No issue with the same back four this Saturday based on last Saturday, even if Tez is fully fit.

Longer term, though, I'd like to see Burn really have to fight for his place as I can see a lot of potential in pairing Tez and Hughes at CH.

My point on Collins was more so overall. Relations between him and TW haven't been great of late, and I noticed that TW said something along of the lines of "It isn't easy when you have the likes of Styche, Ainge and Galbraith not available - big names!" on Saturday evening. No mention of Collins (who is also injured/not available).

Perhaps we do keep the same XI on Saturday, with Ainge, Styche, Tez, etc, on the bench. They would deserve it and I agree re: the point made above that if Saunders has scored/put in a real shift, only to be dropped, that it wouldn't do him any favours.

Main thing is we have strong options again off the back of one of our best results of the season. Complete contrast to the lead up to last Saturday's game (on both counts).
In fairness to TW he can't really call Collins a big miss as in reality due to injuries he has been out of the team an awful lot.

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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Darlogramps » Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:27 am

beatroute66 wrote:
Craig09 wrote:Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him
But Ainge's game is nothing to do with pace? :think:
Bit like the people who complained Turnbull didn't score enough.
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Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Beano » Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:37 am

beatroute66 wrote:
Craig09 wrote:Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him
But Ainge's game is nothing to do with pace? :think:
Lethal in the air and superb at holding the ball up.

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Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by Craig09 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 1:50 pm

beatroute66 wrote:
Craig09 wrote:Styche and ainge are too similar in my opinion and for me ainge is not mobile enough hes not fast enough to be a striker either so for me id put styche straight back in the team with syers or saunders up top with him
But Ainge's game is nothing to do with pace? :think:
Thats why we have not been scoring. Plenty of pace and engery up front on saturday and we bang in 3 ;-)

onewayup
Posts: 1513
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2009 6:02 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Styche and Ainge

Post by onewayup » Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:38 pm

There was never any thought of Harvey being the difference between the teams on Saturday spyman, I think that it would be right that the team that worked their balls off to get the win are allowed to show it wasn't a flash in the pan performance, and are rewarded for their efforts, if it ain't working then bring the players off the bench into play, I think Saturday's players deserve another game together. Again just my opinion.

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