Cool heads

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Darlogramps
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Re: Cool heads

Post by Darlogramps » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:31 am

theoriginalfatcat wrote:How about we bring players in without sacking the manager? Like any other football club would, because our lack of players on Saturday was laughable - how could any manager deal with that? We put a team out without the ability to make a substitution.

I'm not a T.W. fan by the way, I think he's ballsed it up but giving him a fighting chance would be the cheapest option.
We've given him a fighting chance on plenty of occasions, this summer and through last season.

He messed it up and now he's shamelessly clinging on for his pay-off. No tactical ability, no nous, no authority. If we gave him the best budget in the league, he would mess it up.

Keeping Wright is the an expensive option, as we have to pay him and suffer declining attendances under someone who doesn't have a clue. And then suffer the inevitable relegation and the financial hardship that comes with it. And make no mistake, if we don't get rid of Wright, we will go down.
Last edited by Darlogramps on Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:44 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Cool heads

Post by 50 years » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:33 am

"How about we bring players in without sacking the manager? Like any other football club would, because our lack of players on Saturday was laughable - how could any manager deal with that? We put a team out without the ability to make a substitution.

I'm not a T.W. fan by the way, I think he's ballsed it up but giving him a fighting chance would be the cheapest option."



Think this would be my first choice as well, and am sure the board will consider this, the few loans in to date have been good and another 3 or 4 would not go wrong, provide competition and have something to come off the bench, having 11 fit senior players is not good for sure.

Banktopp - never said that we give anyone more money, said it was one of the options that would need to be considered.

LoidLucan
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Re: Cool heads

Post by LoidLucan » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:49 am

Hands up if you have faith in TW assembling another squad of players and organising and drilling them into an effective fighting unit.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Cool heads

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:55 am

LoidLucan wrote:Hands up if you have faith in TW assembling another squad of players and organising and drilling them into an effective fighting unit.
Point taken - I was just pointing out the cheapest option, but on saying that, with a few more players our disposal we would/could/should have won on Saturday.
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H1987
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Re: Cool heads

Post by H1987 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:55 am

Keeping Wright isn't the cheapest option if he takes us down without the semblance of a fight.

We need fighters right now. The bit that frustrates me is the obvious deficiencies that are ignored. We've never replaced Turnbull, and a young lad on loan won't anchor the midfield. In my opinion, an experienced midfielder is a must, and some loans to supplement it all. They need to find the money, whether that's financing it with out departures, so be it.

The bench on Saturday was a joke. Again. Totally unacceptable to have a selection of players you essentially would never want to put on the field in all but desperation. Glover has hardly proven himself yet, and he was the most senior by a considerable distance.

If he has a competitive budget, and we were told he has, then it's his fault for mismanaging it. My overwhelming suspicion is we're paying the likes of Ainge far too much, and that money could probably have covered the wages of, say Gillies *and* Turnbull. My other suspicion is that the squad is size is limited because we're paying travel costs to all the non local lot. Covering that 2-3 times a week could instead probably have paid for some more local lads.

The current lot seem to have absolutely no grasp of the local market at all, which other clubs around us seem to manage well. We should be able to recruit, realistically, all the way down from Newcastle and up from York, without having to offer travel costs. Obviously if we want players to come from further afield, then part of getting them to sign is covering their travel, but it's a significant cost for the club. I don't mind it if you get someone like Styche, who you wouldn't have got locally. They should be exceptions, not the rule, because that's the only place the manager knows to recruit from.

We probably don't have the resources to sack TW, but we would have the option of placing him on gardening leave, and letting AW have a go, and bring in a couple of coaches to support him (Pears? Gregan? Atkinson?). It's the only option if he continues to sink us, and can't motivate the team to turn up for fking training.

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Re: Cool heads

Post by spen666 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:07 pm

LoidLucan wrote:Hands up if you have faith in TW assembling another squad of players and organising and drilling them into an effective fighting unit.

Why did your post make me picture Captain Manwaring of Dads Army?

QUAKERMAN2
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Re: Cool heads

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:14 pm

Could not understand the timing in releasing Syers without a replacement with only Harvey as our striker, yet another baffling decision .Yet again our defending for the 2 goals was poor and for the upteenth time it was down to both full backs being out of position and down to tactics yet again.Sick of the same old excuses and seems teams have this sussed How many goals have we conceded from wide positions, probably about 75%, that is why we need a back 4 not a 3.Pretty obvious to me.

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MKDarlo
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Re: Cool heads

Post by MKDarlo » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:45 pm

Wright has to go. However, we don't need unpleasant scenes like Saturday forcing out the directors as well.

While they should not be immune to criticism they do not deserve direct personal abuse of the kind reported to have been used on Saturday. They also do not need family members abusing at the same time. Lets try and keep it classy eh?

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Re: Cool heads

Post by banktopp » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:58 pm

H1987 wrote:



We probably don't have the resources to sack TW, but we would have the option of placing him on gardening leave, and letting AW have a go, and bring in a couple of coaches to support him (Pears? Gregan? Atkinson?). It's the only option if he continues to sink us, and can't motivate the team to turn up for fking training.
What is the difference between sacking him and paying up his contract, or placing him on gardening leave until his contract runs out ?

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Re: Cool heads

Post by SwansQuaker83 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:59 pm

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
SwansQuaker83 wrote:However, I'm considering other ways of making my feelings known, ultimately joining the band of fans who are staying away or removing their BTB money
Removing money which has been promised is kind of Raj Singh like :thumbdown:
are you comparing fans staying away because they are paying money to watch players who can't be bothered trying, who'd rather spend money on their family to what Raj Singh did?? :roll:

or fans who not only pay gate prices, but 50-50s, merchandise etc etc, AND a monthly amount to the club when they have jobs, families etc and where that money has been wasted, AND they get nothing to show for it, they're not creaming profits off the business or the club.

the club want us to give them money, to give to Wright to build a team, which he has demonstrated beyond any doubt that he is incapable of doing... yet rather than bin him, they're saying, we're keeping him, but do us a favour, can you keep giving us money to give to Wright to waste...?

if DDs have been canceled which we're told anecdotally that they have, I believe they would be re-submitted if we got a new management team in... moreover, a new manager would galvanise the fan base and I believe they'd return if they knew they were getting a local guy who had a squad who showed some pride and effort, even if results didn't dramatically improve, if the effort and entertainment value for money improved, they'd come back and give more, they always have... but right now, if fans are loathed to keep giving money to Wright and a bunch of players who can't even be bothered to turn up to training then I don't blame them one bit.

H1987
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Re: Cool heads

Post by H1987 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:05 pm

Honestly, I hope fans don't, but one of the advantage of being fan owned is that fans have leverage in terms of power and funding. If they don't like how their money is being used, they are free to remove it until someone more appropriate is charged with using it. It's their choice, and we shouldn't judge people for doing so.

al_quaker
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Re: Cool heads

Post by al_quaker » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:06 pm

Cancelling money (i.e. BtB) which was promised to the club because the season has gone to s*** is pretty similar to what Singh did to be fair. In the peak of my anger after the Telford match I considered it, but realised it would only make a bad finanical situation worse so thought better of it. As things stand I sure won't be putting in next season though.

H1987
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Re: Cool heads

Post by H1987 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:10 pm

banktopp wrote:
H1987 wrote:



We probably don't have the resources to sack TW, but we would have the option of placing him on gardening leave, and letting AW have a go, and bring in a couple of coaches to support him (Pears? Gregan? Atkinson?). It's the only option if he continues to sink us, and can't motivate the team to turn up for fking training.
What is the difference between sacking him and paying up his contract, or placing him on gardening leave until his contract runs out ?
We wouldn't have to pay him up front (i'd assume we don't really have that money hanging around), and we'd presumably save money on his travel costs as well (we'll be paying him to come up to Darlington 3 times a week from the midlands I assume). That saving alone is probably not far off being able to employ a part time coach to assist AW.

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Re: Cool heads

Post by tdk1 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:31 pm

If we are paying for his travel then I don't know why. Do you get paid for getting to and from your workplace?

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Re: Cool heads

Post by Yarblockos » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:38 pm

SwansQuaker83 wrote:
LoidLucan wrote:Yes, let's just ignore the fact that we have won 2 in the last 16 games at BM and lost hundreds of fans with the potential to lose even more, let's ignore that TW has clearly lost the confidence of the overwhelming majority of fans and that he now has a winning ratio this season of 19% and that there will be nil chance of getting most supporters to make more of a financial commitment to the club with him at the helm.

Let's forget that it looks like he's lost the confidence of the squad and that he said players have been using every excuse in the book to miss training. Let's ignore that the players largely look unfit, disorganised and dispirited and that TW was handed a good budget in the summer and messed it up and left us with a lightweight, unbalanced squad and forget the fact that he waited until crisis point to make use of the loans market even though he had every opportunity to do so. And just ignore the fact that respected experienced players like Syers couldn't wait to get out of the club.

And yeah it doesn't really matter if we are relegated because we have had bad times and relegations in our past and it's not really that important anyway. And even though he has shown no evidence of any ability or plan to turn this around, let's back him anyway because a tiny minority of fans disgraced themselves at the last home game when we lost to one of the worst sides we have played in years. Makes complete sense to me to do nothing and let TW finish the job.
Couldn't have put it better myself... The fact he's still at the club both stuns me and scares the living daylights out of me... regardless of the scenes Saturday, which we can all agree were disgraceful, the board has let this go on far far too long, the fact that they'd even consider letting it go on another week is baffling and demoralising.

I'm all for Wright out chants and personally I don't think the fans by the clubhouse did anything wrong UNTIL they turned on the board... quite frankly, the players and management (Thommo, Tez and Harvey aside) who are showing absolutely zero effort or pride, skipping training whilst being well paid, deserved it.

However, I'm considering other ways of making my feelings known, ultimately joining the band of fans who are staying away or removing their BTB money, until he's gone. I love going to games even when it's that bad, but when we're a fan owned club that aren't being listened to, I'm wondering whether voting with my feet and my wallet is the best option. I have a 18 month old son, who doesn't want for anything, but quite frankly I'd rather take him out on a Saturday afternoon and spend my money on him, than give it to that idiot and his band of pathetic players. I don't want to hit the club where it hurts but I think that the board are fundamentally wrong on this and have been for months... therefore, I'd consider hitting them in the wallet to show my displeasure... it's certainly way more constructive than yelling expletives at the board, volunteers and their families... just a question of whether I can actually bring myself not to go.

I know people would say we should be supporting the team, pulling together, getting behind them etc, but I think it's past that now... I don't think Wright's even interested anymore, he's blaming the fans, the players, everyone but himself, he looks like a man trying to engineer a sacking to get a pay out.
You make a good point about the board letting this go on as long as it has. If you want to understand it, I think you need to read through the things DJ has said since he came to the club. The priority is for the club to be debt free at the end of the season. The reason for this is that it will make us more attractive to investors to support the 4G pitch and clubhouse. DJ is thinking entirely about the long term financial prospects while neglecting our current on the field performance. He's now finding out that what happens on the field affects the finances and vice-versa, possibly being CEO of a football club is a lot harder than running an airport.

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Re: Cool heads

Post by banktopp » Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:47 pm

H1987 wrote:
banktopp wrote:
H1987 wrote:



We probably don't have the resources to sack TW, but we would have the option of placing him on gardening leave, and letting AW have a go, and bring in a couple of coaches to support him (Pears? Gregan? Atkinson?). It's the only option if he continues to sink us, and can't motivate the team to turn up for fking training.
What is the difference between sacking him and paying up his contract, or placing him on gardening leave until his contract runs out ?
We wouldn't have to pay him up front (i'd assume we don't really have that money hanging around), and we'd presumably save money on his travel costs as well (we'll be paying him to come up to Darlington 3 times a week from the midlands I assume). That saving alone is probably not far off being able to employ a part time coach to assist AW.
So if Wright goes are you seriously saying put AW in charge ?
Surely he must have input now and as such he is as culpable as TW. If he doesn't have any influence then what is the point of him being assistant.

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Re: Cool heads

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:54 pm

banktopp wrote:
H1987 wrote:
banktopp wrote:
H1987 wrote:



We probably don't have the resources to sack TW, but we would have the option of placing him on gardening leave, and letting AW have a go, and bring in a couple of coaches to support him (Pears? Gregan? Atkinson?). It's the only option if he continues to sink us, and can't motivate the team to turn up for fking training.
What is the difference between sacking him and paying up his contract, or placing him on gardening leave until his contract runs out ?
We wouldn't have to pay him up front (i'd assume we don't really have that money hanging around), and we'd presumably save money on his travel costs as well (we'll be paying him to come up to Darlington 3 times a week from the midlands I assume). That saving alone is probably not far off being able to employ a part time coach to assist AW.
So if Wright goes are you seriously saying put AW in charge ?
Surely he must have input now and as such he is as culpable as TW. If he doesn't have any influence then what is the point of him being assistant.
Happens quite often manager goes and assistant takes over temporary, so in theory not the worst idea.
Whether it's the right idea currently is a different discussion.

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Re: Cool heads

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:58 pm

al_quaker wrote:Cancelling money (i.e. BtB) which was promised to the club because the season has gone to s*** is pretty similar to what Singh did to be fair. In the peak of my anger after the Telford match I considered it, but realised it would only make a bad finanical situation worse so thought better of it. As things stand I sure won't be putting in next season though.
Agree, I would not cancel my DD for this season, I agreed to fund the club the amount agreed and I won't cancel it.

I am also quite willing to continue the support next season under most circs, however if we continue with Wright and get relegated and then allow him to try again next season I am highly unlikely to continue contributing.

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Re: Cool heads

Post by Wiseacre » Mon Dec 10, 2018 3:05 pm

I agree with Banktop about AW. In my view it's our back line that really struggles and if White has any sway surely it's with our defence. Those two should have been able to much better than they have and we know that once in a blue moon they turn out a team that can play - something's gone badly wrong and I wonder if we've come too far too fast - something else we can blame MG for. Paradoxically, if they can keep us up now it will be a real managerial achievement. Let's keep calm and carry on. As regards new faces for the team, I've noticed a few references on the site to advertising boards, why not try them out in defence ? They can be quite mobile on a windy day, more mobile than Ainge anyway. Our full backs need some cover.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Cool heads

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:14 pm

SwansQuaker83 wrote:are you comparing fans staying away because they are paying money to watch players who can't be bothered trying, who'd rather spend money on their family to what Raj Singh did??
Er no. You're overdoing it a little.

Deciding to stay away is a completely different thing, I would never criticise anyone for deciding not to turn up because football is meant to be enjoyable and if you don't enjoy it then it's fine not to go, however the Boost The Budget thing is different - it was a financial commitment, so much a month, probably something small.

What I meant was Singh pulled the financial plug out and look how vilified he became. It would be Singh like to stop your payments at this time, and let's not forget we could move forward again if new players are brought in or something else changes. There is a massive problem with the BTB scheme, I share your concerns and I feel it's backfired somewhat as now it's causing bad feeling, and of course next season it will be a very hard sell.

If you're seriously considering cancelling your input, write in to the Netcafe before Friday and ask a question around this subject.

I have done exactly that.
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jjljks
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Re: Cool heads

Post by jjljks » Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:58 pm

Can anyone confirm how long TW has to run on his contract? Also be useful if rather intrusive to know how much he is getting per year as only then can we make informed decisions as to whether it makes sense to sack him or not. :?

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Re: Cool heads

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:34 pm

jjljks wrote:Can anyone confirm how long TW has to run on his contract? Also be useful if rather intrusive to know how much he is getting per year as only then can we make informed decisions as to whether it makes sense to sack him or not. :?
Do you honestly think we will be told his salary.Jesus!

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Re: Cool heads

Post by Darlo_Pete » Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:16 pm

lo36789 wrote:Erm Pete...suspect you know this and this is deliberate but pretty sure DJ had zero interest in Darlington FC before Martin Gray asked him to get involved - Im not sure he ever claimed to be a devout fan previous to taking his role.
I agree but now DJ is very much involved in the club and loves the club, probably not quite so much after Saturday!

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