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 Post subject: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:05 pm 
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Just read this article, an article which gives an insight into the financial madness in this league.

Reading this Bradford PA have lost £1m since 2015, and they will be looking to cut their cloth moving forward. Insane money for a regional largely part time league....

https://bpafc.com/director-jonathan-col ... able-club/


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:17 pm 
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Might be a decent manager available at the end of the season by looks of things...


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:28 pm 
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From when I wonder? If it's close season then expect a fire sale. One thing's for sure, they can't afford to go up. Also, are they more than 1 million in debt, and who has been bankrolling them? The statement seems like a bit of an ultimatum for more fans.

Also, didn't Brackley's sugar daddy say he'd stop putting money in after this season if they didn't go up?


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:54 pm 
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They cut there cloth at the end of last season ,but with there bargaining in the summer and there manager look where they are..

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:29 pm 
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HarrytheQuaker wrote:
They cut there cloth at the end of last season ,but with there bargaining in the summer and there manager look where they are..

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By the looks of it they need to cut it even further, losses of over a million pound since 2015 that they clearly aren’t prepared to continue with.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:41 pm 
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Vodka_Vic wrote:
From when I wonder? If it's close season then expect a fire sale. One thing's for sure, they can't afford to go up. Also, are they more than 1 million in debt, and who has been bankrolling them? The statement seems like a bit of an ultimatum for more fans.

Also, didn't Brackley's sugar daddy say he'd stop putting money in after this season if they didn't go up?
Maybe, like is under Houghton and Singh, nobody has been bankrolling them and owners have just been building up debt against the club.

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:45 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:50 pm 
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Not after he missed that free header against us in injury time last year.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:15 pm 
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I've seen a few comments about BPA on this forum in the last few months, mainly going on about how they are upsetting the odds, punching above their weight, have a brilliant manager, and so on. But really all of those uninformed comments were based on the idea that they were somehow doing it all on a shoe string. Not so, they have spent over a million squiddlies above their natural financial level, just like Uncle Brad has. No surprise really.

Just another bankrolled club.

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:51 am 
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Sad to say this is yet another example of football being failed by fundamental funding issues. Not enough money from the Premiership and pro leagues getting down to grass roots level. FA have lost all direction and failed to move with the times to safeguard our national game. It is only time until top clubs break away from the national set-up to form an exclusive European Super League and football clubs at the bottom of the pyramid will fold due to lack of funding, leading to collapse of the entire structure.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:25 am 
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Is it to do with funding? Is it not just overspending? If BPA had received an extra £1m over the last few years would they not have just spent £1m more and be in the same boat? Too many clubs want to get ahead so much they gamble their futures on it, I don't think giving them more money is going to change anything.

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:37 am 
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jjljks wrote:
Not enough money from the Premiership and pro leagues getting down to grass roots level. FA have lost all direction and failed to move with the times to safeguard our national game.


Everything you say is true but it’s not really relevant to us. We are not a grass roots team. Grass roots football is amateur and kids you know the but where football does good for inclusion, health & wellbeing etc.

We are not fighting on a level playing field when it comes to funding that is all - it probably won’t change and who knows maybe one day a darlo fan wins the Euro millions and donates a sizeable amount to us - we wouldn’t turn our noses up but we’d still be in control of our destiny.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:54 am 
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Makka Pakka wrote:
Is it to do with funding? Is it not just overspending? If BPA had received an extra £1m over the last few years would they not have just spent £1m more and be in the same boat? Too many clubs want to get ahead so much they gamble their futures on it, I don't think giving them more money is going to change anything.


Exactly. I remember the itv digital thing years ago when Reynolds first took over.

They pumped a load of money into the lower leagues but many clubs had it spent on players and players wages before they’d even received the money. ITV digital then went bust and left debts, and the clubs had even more problems.

The fact is you have to live within your means! York are overspending now, but what happens when all the family silver is sold?

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:16 am 
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Thinking back twenty years, there were normally only a handful of strong Conference sides that had realistic aspirations of making it in the football league. Fast forward to 2019, and there seems to be clubs from as far as tier 7/8 with said dreams and a local business-done-good types willing to bankroll it.

Sadly, there are still as many league places as there always was and for every Fleetwood and Crawley there are umpteen basket cases who end up in the s***.

It strikes me that the vast majority of owners who wish to propel a club through the leagues have no genuine idea how much it will cost, how to execute it successfully and how to make their club even remotely self-sustainable.

Hindsight, eh?


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:32 am 
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The flip side is that for every single one of these clubs pushing to the promised land (FL) someone else falls out of the trap door and it usually spells trouble for them.

Not sure what the answer is. I start to wonder if the chasm between Championship and League One is becoming greater than Premiership / Championship (look at Rotherham / Burton Albion recently). The top of the NL is probably as strong as the majority of League One nowadays as well.

Would a re-jig of the league structure make things a bit more sensible, or will it just create new issues.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:49 am 
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lo36789 wrote:
The flip side is that for every single one of these clubs pushing to the promised land (FL) someone else falls out of the trap door and it usually spells trouble for them.

Not sure what the answer is. I start to wonder if the chasm between Championship and League One is becoming greater than Premiership / Championship (look at Rotherham / Burton Albion recently). The top of the NL is probably as strong as the majority of League One nowadays as well.

Would a re-jig of the league structure make things a bit more sensible, or will it just create new issues.


I’ve long thought that a merger of League 2 and the National league, with a North / South divide would help costs. It would allow for the stronger National League teams to fulfil their aspirations of being in the league without bankrupting themselves, away attendances would be better and travel / hotel costs reduced. The difficulty would be the promotion / relegation places from the new league to League 1 as each of the regional leagues would want 3 promotion places and League 1 teams wouldn’t want 6 going down. Maybe there could be a playoff using the 5th and 6th worst teams in League 1 and the third-place team in each regional league.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:56 am 
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MB86DFC wrote:
Maybe there could be a playoff using the 5th and 6th worst teams in League 1 and the third-place team in each regional league.

Sounds too much like the Scottish leagues. Don't they do something similar with relegation and play-offs?

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:03 am 
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lo36789 wrote:
The top of the NL is probably as strong as the majority of League One nowadays as well.



:roll: Where do you dream this shite up?

Unless of course you meant the Northern League :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:11 pm 
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Ghost_Of_1883 wrote:
Where do you dream this shite up?


I reckon Orient, Fylde, Wrexham and Salford would all be able to easily compete in League One if they were parachuted into those divisions now.

From 11th in League One to 7th in National League (ignoring those at the top of League Two) I really think the difference in quality, mostly because of minimal difference in budgets is pretty minimal.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:13 pm 
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lo36789 wrote:
Ghost_Of_1883 wrote:
Where do you dream this shite up?


I reckon Orient, Fylde, Wrexham and Salford would all be able to easily compete in League One if they were parachuted into those divisions now.

From 11th in League One to 7th in National League (ignoring those at the top of League Two) I really think the difference in quality, mostly because of minimal difference in budgets is pretty minimal.

Wrexham? Behave eh, that club bottles it every year.

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:25 pm 
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Bradford PA are owned by an oil tycoon called Gareth Roberts who lives in Texas but is from Bradford. He has bankrolled them to the tune of seven figures in the last three years and this season has been looking at a mid-six-figure loss. Money has gone into the pitch, the ground and the team and they have a healthy budget this season. However, no matter what they do they can't seem to increase their crowds and have sometimes struggled to pull in more than 400 or 500 of their own fans and now it looks like the financial cushion is going to be pulled back. Without Roberts, they could well have ended up in a league or two lower.

An example of how quickly it can all fall apart is North Ferriby. FA Trophy winners in 2015 and a National League side in 2016-17, they are now looking at their third relegation on the spin, sometimes get crowds of 150 and there are attempts to rename them East Hull and move the club closer to Hull. The threatened end of the road follows the withdrawal of bankrolling which gave them their time in the spotlight. They were OK while the cash was on tap but the end of that showed a tiny club exposed as way out of its depth without the fanbase to carry it forward.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:39 pm 
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lo36789 wrote:
Ghost_Of_1883 wrote:
Where do you dream this shite up?


I reckon Orient, Fylde, Wrexham and Salford would all be able to easily compete in League One if they were parachuted into those divisions now.

From 11th in League One to 7th in National League (ignoring those at the top of League Two) I really think the difference in quality, mostly because of minimal difference in budgets is pretty minimal.



I think you are over estimating the sides in National League.

Being a regular at Orient, I would expect them to be mid to lower half of L2 if they were there. They would be hammered in L1. They are not that good.

The most impressive side I have seen in National League were Salford, even then I would only put them perhaps top half of L2 at best

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:37 pm 
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Not a chance Orient or Wrexham would compete in Division 1. Fylde and Salford only if they spent big, which they feasibly could, but not with existing squads.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:39 pm 
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Maybe BPA get low crowds because everyone supports city in league one?


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:03 pm 
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Quaker85 wrote:
Maybe BPA get low crowds because everyone supports city in league one?


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This. Bradford is in a football saturated area and also competes with a strong rugby league following. BPA are always only going to be a fan's second club, they might go when Leeds/Bradford or whoever they support first aren't playing but I can't imagine they'll ever get the following to be a self-sustaining club at this level.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:09 pm 
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LoidLucan wrote:
Bradford PA are owned by an oil tycoon called Gareth Roberts who lives in Texas but is from Bradford. He has bankrolled them to the tune of seven figures in the last three years and this season has been looking at a mid-six-figure loss. Money has gone into the pitch, the ground and the team and they have a healthy budget this season. However, no matter what they do they can't seem to increase their crowds and have sometimes struggled to pull in more than 400 or 500 of their own fans and now it looks like the financial cushion is going to be pulled back. Without Roberts, they could well have ended up in a league or two lower.

An example of how quickly it can all fall apart is North Ferriby. FA Trophy winners in 2015 and a National League side in 2016-17, they are now looking at their third relegation on the spin, sometimes get crowds of 150 and there are attempts to rename them East Hull and move the club closer to Hull. The threatened end of the road follows the withdrawal of bankrolling which gave them their time in the spotlight. They were OK while the cash was on tap but the end of that showed a tiny club exposed as way out of its depth without the fanbase to carry it forward.


Money on the ground? Is that the small hut behind the goal. As much as Blackwell isn’t great, I’d take it over BPA’s ground - in its current state


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:54 am 
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I thought bradford pa were simply tenants at a athletics stadium like gateshead are. As for the fa and money not filtering down, it does dont it with stadium improvement grants that are available. The fa and premier league often get hammer when a non league team is in trouble but not sure what they can do especially if silly wages are been paid out

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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:37 am 
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Feel sorry for Bradford PA fans, as they seem a nice bunch. Obviously they still live on their past as a league club. But their ground isn't their own and although there looks plenty of room to develop it, unlike ours, they're not going to do that if they don't own it. I hope they survive and we're playing them next season.


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 Post subject: Re: Bradford Park Avenue
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:34 am 
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shildonlad wrote:
I thought bradford pa were simply tenants at a athletics stadium like gateshead are. As for the fa and money not filtering down, it does dont it with stadium improvement grants that are available. The fa and premier league often get hammer when a non league team is in trouble but not sure what they can do especially if silly wages are been paid out


The wages are one of the key causes of clubs collapsing. Whether we like it or not, football is a business and we have to work to a budget which is set by the income. Think there is room for performance related pay!


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