Early Bird Season Tickets

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al_quaker
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Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by al_quaker » Fri Mar 01, 2019 9:54 am

available now

https://darlingtonfc.co.uk/news/early-b ... ces-frozen

Prices frozen, and also 18-21s are now classed as concessions, which I think is a good move.

Available until 6th April

Darlo_Pete
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Darlo_Pete » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:27 am

In theory it's a good idea, but it may help plug cash shortfalls that we are facing now, but surely it makes for bigger problems over the summer months. Also is freezing prices the way to go forward, a modest price rise would help to raise more money. :thumbdown:

al_quaker
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by al_quaker » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:34 am

Darlo_Pete wrote:Also is freezing prices the way to go forward, a modest price rise would help to raise more money. :thumbdown:
There's a 'donation' section on the online form if you feel that the season tickets are underpriced

Darlo2807
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Darlo2807 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:38 am

‘Early bird’ ends on April 6th. We must be skint

AndyPark
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by AndyPark » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:48 am

We were told of a shortfall this month, this'll be it.
18/19 Season:
LDWDLDLWDLLWWWDDDDLLLLWDWWLWDLLDWDLDLLWLLWWWLD

*includes all cup games*

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Mar 01, 2019 11:03 am

al_quaker wrote:
Darlo_Pete wrote:Also is freezing prices the way to go forward, a modest price rise would help to raise more money. :thumbdown:
There's a 'donation' section on the online form if you feel that the season tickets are underpriced

Can't say fairer than that, Darlo Pete's issue solved.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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spen666
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by spen666 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 11:05 am

Darlo_Pete wrote: Also is freezing prices the way to go forward, a modest price rise would help to raise more money. :thumbdown:
You would be right if everyone would renew their season ticket irrespective of the price charged.

If for example you increase the season ticket price but lost season ticket holders, then its a false economy. Those who can't/ won't pay an increased price for season tickets are unlikely to attend games regularly where the cost to them will be even more, meaning a loss in crowd numbers, a loss of sales of sundries, eg programmes, food, drinks etc.

More importantly you would be eroding the crowd base long term and increase the pressures on the remaining fans.

Its not a simple case of increase price = more income as demand is price elastic. You may be a devoted and die hard fan who will pay whatever the club want, but many people aren't and will vote with their wallets, either out of necessity or choice.

It is important to remember the majority of fans of a club are not in reality die-hards irrespective of costs. Clubs have to work to attract more fans and not rely on the current fans as cash cows.

Darlington recognise this, even if you don't appear to
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don'tbuythesun
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by don'tbuythesun » Fri Mar 01, 2019 11:47 am

It makes me all warm and fuzzy inside that Spen spends so much time here giving us help and advice. He's very lucky that his chairman has put over £1,000,000 into his club.

darlo999
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by darlo999 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 11:58 am

I won’t be renewing my two season tickets whilst Mr Wright is in charge. The football we play is shocking and his tactics just don’t work...playing players out of position and signing some shocking players, that simply just don’t cut it at this level. Time for a change!
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Alfie
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Alfie » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:17 pm

Same prices regardless of which league we are in next season?

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divas
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by divas » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:20 pm

Darlo_Pete wrote:In theory it's a good idea, but it may help plug cash shortfalls that we are facing now, but surely it makes for bigger problems over the summer months. Also is freezing prices the way to go forward, a modest price rise would help to raise more money. :thumbdown:
What are you even wittering on about? Which problems over the summer months?

Gow9900
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Gow9900 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:33 pm

I'll be renewing mine, had one for years through thick and thin, mainly thin. Not stopping now because we have had a bad season, even though the football is awful and I sadly have little faith in the current management.

With regards to people not renewing, completely their choice.

The way I see it, monies made from season ticket sales will go a long way in determining next seasons budget, imagine if the sales plummet, we have less money coming into the club, which means a smaller budget, which likely means pitching the job to potential new managers will be extremely difficult with a small budget, therefore diminishing the quality of people willing to take the job on, meaning we either stick with Tommy or get a cheap option in and end up having the exact same situation next season. The fact that we were a football league club once means nothing when you have a large percentage of clubs in this league being propped up and financed by owners, ambitious managers will decide whether they want to take a job on based on the resources that will be at their disposal, not that 'Darlo are a decent sized club, used to be a football league club so I'll go there'. I know people that think that managers think like that, they don't. It's all what budget will be available. Simple as.

So if lots of people don't renew and we have less money, we have to hope that more monies are generated from commercial (from what we hear excellent work being done on increasing this since Craig Morley has come in but this is a slow and long term thing that will build gradually rather than produce huge returns short term), that monies generated from the new academy can make up the shortfall from reduced tickets sales be it on season tickets or a matchday, take out loans to then hopefully pay back at some point which would be unlikely and insanely risky or we manage to snare an 'investor'.

When I say an investor I mean some extremely rich person who is prepared to throw lots of their personal wealth into the football club with no return as that is ultimately what would be needed, as even if we got into the football league we are never going to generate enough for an individual to get back the millions it would take us to get back there. The majority of the clubs in the football league are financial basket cases being propped up by individuals, even at League Two level.

I don't envy the board to be honest, we've got some extremely good people in there that have incredible experience and CV's and some of which are proper Darlo fans, but they're slaughtered if we cut our costs and slaughtered if we overspend. They might well get rid of Tommy, but trying to attract a decent replacement and provide that replacement with a competitive budget will be difficult if season ticket sales are awful. And for the record I do want a new manager, but we have to have the finance in place to get a decent appointment, rather than sacking him and then having no options. I'd be pretty confident that the board have a list of replacements, but it will all be budget dependent as to whether we can get who we want.

The problem we have is that the more crowds and interest diminishes the club will shrink and then we will get to the point when we are treading water in the glue leagues and it'll be even harder to get back to anywhere near where we once were.

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by AndyPark » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:15 pm

Gonna get one myself for next season.

Are the club gonna give the option of pay it over 3 payments? Sure they offered it last year..
18/19 Season:
LDWDLDLWDLLWWWDDDDLLLLWDWWLWDLLDWDLDLLWLLWWWLD

*includes all cup games*

Quakerlad
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Quakerlad » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:21 pm

We seem to be in just a complete mess again!

The 500 club extension obviously hasn't been taken up by as many as needed so now we resort to offering reduced price season tickets for next year , 2 months before this season finishes! It's just again taking future income to fix a current issue!

That's at least 3/4 times we have been told that this cash will put us on a sound footing i.e. £50k raised by fans last March following Dolphin centre meeting, selling Heaton, selling Styche and now again.

Even BTB is now going to go into the financial mess pot rather than purely for all we really want and that's a half decent team to watch.

Anyone who doesn't think it's a mess has rose tinted glasses on!

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divas
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by divas » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:23 pm

I’m pretty sure there will be the opportunity to buy in instalments once the early bird window has closed

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by AndyPark » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:27 pm

Quakerlad wrote:so now we resort to offering reduced price season tickets for next year , 2 months before this season finishes! It's just again taking future income to fix a current issue!
A lot of clubs offer the early-bird specials before a current season finishes. Are they all in meltdowns too? :crazy:
18/19 Season:
LDWDLDLWDLLWWWDDDDLLLLWDWWLWDLLDWDLDLLWLLWWWLD

*includes all cup games*

H1987
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by H1987 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:28 pm

Why is anyone surprised by this? Loads of clubs offer an early bird discount at this sort of time. Even Boro do it, and they're not short of money.

No one is making you pay it now, but some will, then presumably some will pay later at an increased price, and some will pay in instalments, hopefully staggering our income. I can't see any problem with this at all.

As for season tickets, it's entirely personal choice.

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divas
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by divas » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:32 pm

Quakerlad wrote:We seem to be in just a complete mess again!

The 500 club extension obviously hasn't been taken up by as many as needed so now we resort to offering reduced price season tickets for next year , 2 months before this season finishes! It's just again taking future income to fix a current issue!

That's at least 3/4 times we have been told that this cash will put us on a sound footing i.e. £50k raised by fans last March following Dolphin centre meeting, selling Heaton, selling Styche and now again.

Even BTB is now going to go into the financial mess pot rather than purely for all we really want and that's a half decent team to watch.

Anyone who doesn't think it's a mess has rose tinted glasses on!
This is normal operating procedure for the club and has been since the season that EB season tickets first had to be offered in order to cover a shortfall. In the first season that they were offered the club would have banked 2 years worth of season ticket money in a single financial year. That meant that once you start the next season you’re starting from a poor poisition as the only revenue you have is non EB ST revenue which is a fraction of the EB.

That means that again in that season you need to offer EB ST again otherwise you’ll have almost no ST income. And so the cycle has to repeat every year so you’re taking your season ticket income at the end of the season rather than the beginning. It only takes one season to get into this situation - look around the whole football league - just about every club have to do this.

The only way you can get back on track is to have an exceptional year with lots of unbudgeted income that means you don’t need any ST money in that season and can afford to get back on track. For me it’s not a big deal as we’re still allocating one lot of season ticket revenue every season, the only draw back is that you do lose one of your contingencies which is why instead of running an EB scheme if we had been on track we’ve had to run 500 club. We are where we are after years of overspend and juggling finances to build a new ground which is why we’re tightening our belts - the issue is more to do with past seasons more than than this. You know those seasons people reminisce about because we could blow opposition out of the water spending money we didn’t really have.

Before continually criticising the running of the finances I wish you’d take a minute to ingest some of the good information that’s punished around the challenges with the finances and why we are where we are instead of only hearing what you want to hear.

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Gow9900 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:34 pm

We've put early bird season tickets on sale at this time in the last three years.

Lot's of flapping over nothing. If this was the first time then I could understand the flapping but it's not. To me it shows that there is plenty of forward planning work being done.

If you go onto the news section of google and search 'early bird season tickets' you will see that lots of clubs up and down the country are doing this. It's. Not. Just. Us.

Quakerlad
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Quakerlad » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:44 pm

Surely though in last 12 months we have had the most " unbudgeted" amount of income we have had since we reformed ie. £50k fans, £20k celebration, current 500 club extension, plus sales of Heaton, styche, Gillies, Turnbull etc so on your argument we should be on a better place than we are. Don't tell me any of those above were actually budgeted into the financial projections.

Agree we are where we are but it doesn't prevent opinions and criticisms, some we agree with, others we don't and that's fine.

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by banktopp » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:47 pm

Quakerlad wrote:We seem to be in just a complete mess again!

The 500 club extension obviously hasn't been taken up by as many as needed so now we resort to offering reduced price season tickets for next year , 2 months before this season finishes! It's just again taking future income to fix a current issue!

That's at least 3/4 times we have been told that this cash will put us on a sound footing i.e. £50k raised by fans last March following Dolphin centre meeting, selling Heaton, selling Styche and now again.

Even BTB is now going to go into the financial mess pot rather than purely for all we really want and that's a half decent team to watch.

Anyone who doesn't think it's a mess has rose tinted glasses on!
What would be a complete mess is another administration.
We are fortunate to have a pragmatic board who in my view are doing their utmost best to guide this club forward.
We do not have a rich benefactor, we do not have rich fans, we do not have revenue from any cup run this season, but we do have falling attendances and we do have bills to pay, and without support from the owners, us fans, we won't have a team to support in the future.
This is why BTB or whatever funding name is it is called is essential to the survival of the club and anyone not renewing is shortsighted.
Early season tickets, 500 club extensions, are essential to bring cash in, and if I am asked to renew my BTB contribution early I shall.

darlo reborn
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by darlo reborn » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:54 pm

I`ll be renewing mine as if I didn`t then this season I probably would have given up as the football on offer has been mostly rubbish.

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divas
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by divas » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:04 pm

Quakerlad wrote:Surely though in last 12 months we have had the most " unbudgeted" amount of income we have had since we reformed ie. £50k fans, £20k celebration, current 500 club extension, plus sales of Heaton, styche, Gillies, Turnbull etc so on your argument we should be on a better place than we are. Don't tell me any of those above were actually budgeted into the financial projections.

Agree we are where we are but it doesn't prevent opinions and criticisms, some we agree with, others we don't and that's fine.
I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. The budget set last season was ridiculous. If MG hadn’t walked away and come back with York’s cash to buy our players then I’m not sure if we’d still have a club. The accounts are there in black and white. There was around £100k increase in playing budget from the prior year (where we’d already made a loss) with no reason to believe that the income would increase - it was madness. Somehow we got lucky with the unbudgeted income which actually meant last season wasn’t a total and utter disaster. If you tot your numbers up above you might find they’re somewhere near that £100k budget increase - little coincidence.

I’m not party to what the playing budget was this year but we at least had an extra £40k or so from btb than we had the prior year but it sounds as though it was still too much as it’s common knowledge it will be reduced again this year.

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Robbie Painter
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Robbie Painter » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:18 pm

The early bird season tickets time window is very similar to the last two years. March 1st has always been when we planned to put the early birds on sale this year.

Last season we launched it in late Feb, this year on March 1st.

In 2017 the early bird window closed on April 15th.
This year its closing on April 6th as that coincides with a home game.

Quakerlad
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Quakerlad » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:31 pm

But I'm talking about the last 12 mths not the one previous. Totally accept what was done then was completely wrong and yes Beck, Bartlett, ferguson etc helped her s through that period.
Surely though, at the end of last season the board set the budget for this current season based on the forecasts for thIs seasons income with complete knowledge of the previous years mess. On that basis you cannot keep referring to the MG era and budget etc .
All I am saying is that THIS last 12 mths has seen the most unbudgeted income we could ever hope for probably and it is still a mess.
Anyway let's leave it at that as none of us can really comment accurately without seeing the income and expenditure detail

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don'tbuythesun
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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by don'tbuythesun » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:33 pm

I suppose there's a clue in the word early?

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by Yarblockos » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:43 pm

Quakerlad wrote:But I'm talking about the last 12 mths not the one previous. Totally accept what was done then was completely wrong and yes Beck, Bartlett, ferguson etc helped her s through that period.
Surely though, at the end of last season the board set the budget for this current season based on the forecasts for thIs seasons income with complete knowledge of the previous years mess. On that basis you cannot keep referring to the MG era and budget etc .
All I am saying is that THIS last 12 mths has seen the most unbudgeted income we could ever hope for probably and it is still a mess.
Anyway let's leave it at that as none of us can really comment accurately without seeing the income and expenditure detail
DJ admitted that the forecasts for income this season turned out to be overly optimistic. This accounts for the shortfall. Given that we've sold players and still have a shortfall it's beginning to look like it was a pretty monumental miscalculation. I'd like to believe this was due to over predicting the gates at our pre-season games rather than a cock-up, but I'm not too sure.

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by quakersfan » Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:09 pm

Early Bird is done by lots of clubs as it’s March/April when most clubs have cash problems.
I presume it’s covering staff wages to get us to the end of the season. As a fan owned club it would be good to have a quarterly overview rather than just at the AGM, would that be possible Divas?

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by HarrytheQuaker » Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:12 pm

AndyPark wrote:
Quakerlad wrote:so now we resort to offering reduced price season tickets for next year , 2 months before this season finishes! It's just again taking future income to fix a current issue!
A lot of clubs offer the early-bird specials before a current season finishes. Are they all in meltdowns too? :crazy:
Our lass renewed her frozen for the past 6 years Leeds season ticket 3 weeks ago, yes different regarding leagues but they must be in meltdown too

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Re: Early Bird Season Tickets

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:22 pm

divas wrote:
Quakerlad wrote:We seem to be in just a complete mess again!

The 500 club extension obviously hasn't been taken up by as many as needed so now we resort to offering reduced price season tickets for next year , 2 months before this season finishes! It's just again taking future income to fix a current issue!

That's at least 3/4 times we have been told that this cash will put us on a sound footing i.e. £50k raised by fans last March following Dolphin centre meeting, selling Heaton, selling Styche and now again.

Even BTB is now going to go into the financial mess pot rather than purely for all we really want and that's a half decent team to watch.

Anyone who doesn't think it's a mess has rose tinted glasses on!
This is normal operating procedure for the club and has been since the season that EB season tickets first had to be offered in order to cover a shortfall. In the first season that they were offered the club would have banked 2 years worth of season ticket money in a single financial year. That meant that once you start the next season you’re starting from a poor poisition as the only revenue you have is non EB ST revenue which is a fraction of the EB.

That means that again in that season you need to offer EB ST again otherwise you’ll have almost no ST income. And so the cycle has to repeat every year so you’re taking your season ticket income at the end of the season rather than the beginning. It only takes one season to get into this situation - look around the whole football league - just about every club have to do this.

The only way you can get back on track is to have an exceptional year with lots of unbudgeted income that means you don’t need any ST money in that season and can afford to get back on track. For me it’s not a big deal as we’re still allocating one lot of season ticket revenue every season, the only draw back is that you do lose one of your contingencies which is why instead of running an EB scheme if we had been on track we’ve had to run 500 club. We are where we are after years of overspend and juggling finances to build a new ground which is why we’re tightening our belts - the issue is more to do with past seasons more than than this. You know those seasons people reminisce about because we could blow opposition out of the water spending money we didn’t really have.

Before continually criticising the running of the finances I wish you’d take a minute to ingest some of the good information that’s punished around the challenges with the finances and why we are where we are instead of only hearing what you want to hear.
This from Divas is what people should be reading to understand where our finances are. :clap: :clap:

Also people should try looking through the accounts, as some others have quoted numbers on here recently. it's a really good insight into where are as a club and the effort it will take to turn us into a smoother financial operation.

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