TW - Learning His Trade

Open now for discussion of all things Darlo!

Moderators: botrash, mikkyx, charlie, uncovered

B_Little
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2010 6:27 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

TW - Learning His Trade

Post by B_Little » Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:43 am

TW has learnt a hell of a lot this season about managing a squad and footy finances. If TW is here next season I think will see a player budget used with real purpose. Also player budget savings by making much more use of the loan market. Getting quality players from loan signings and on the cheap. This mix could make for a good season in term of a cup run, climbing up the league table and keeping finances in check.

I believe this season was a massive learning curve that be a big benefit going into next season. Nothing gained from changing the team management team again.

Darlo were outstanding yesterday. Boston could not cope and were out of their depth.

Up The Darlo

super_les_mcjannet
Posts: 5414
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:41 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:18 am

Did he not learn anything at his time with Nuneaton & Corby.

I have no issue with those who would give him another year, however if we are 10 games in next season and down to around 1k crowds, what’s the plan - sack him or not?

MCFCDarlo3
Posts: 681
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2014 8:28 pm
Team Supported: Manc born Darlo & City
Location: Manchester

TW - Learning His Trade

Post by MCFCDarlo3 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:37 am

Last weekend I met some senior figures at a club TW was at previously and although they said he was a nice chap they didnt want him back.

I like TW but I dont feel he will ever learn, he cant organise a defence and seems to see the obvious (strong holding midfielder arrives March) far too late.

A few wins against clubs who have jack s*** to play for does not make a season.It has been awful and next season could be a disaster crowd wise as the fans need hope which is now almost non existent.

I think TW will be gone no later than October, shame as I like him as a person.

eddie-rowles
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 7:51 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by eddie-rowles » Sun Apr 14, 2019 2:14 pm

Oh God please No! Another season or even part season with TW in charge will finish off our club.
Falling attendances will not be reversed if he stays and before the end of August mutterings and complaints would increase tenfold.
Look he tried his tactics and training methods had 18 months did his best but was not good enough. Players unhappy, skipped training, took the piss and his signings were overwhelmingly abysmal. we move on and hopefully re- energise players and supporters and loanees from Barnsley, Huddersfield maybe the way instead of Sunderland or M'boro?

Emdubya
Posts: 677
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:31 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Emdubya » Sun Apr 14, 2019 2:30 pm

If that man stays we will be next seasons Nuneaton.Get him out and we might have a chance of a reasonable BTB for the next manager

Lallacab
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2016 6:49 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Lallacab » Sun Apr 14, 2019 2:38 pm

Emdubya wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 2:30 pm
If that man stays we will be next seasons Nuneaton.Get him out and we might have a chance of a reasonable BTB for the next manager

For me it’s definitely time for a change!

Season Ticket sales down , attendances dropping - we really need a change to boost us fans and give some hope going into the summer when , undoubtedly, the fans will again rally round and back the club with the BTB

Alfie
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 8:33 am
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Eye, Suffolk

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Alfie » Sun Apr 14, 2019 5:27 pm

If we had a vacancy, would someone (ex Darlo or otherwise) with a five year record like Wright be on the list of potential managers?

shildonlad
Posts: 377
Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 9:53 pm
Team Supported: Newcastle united and gatesheas
Location: Chesterfield

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by shildonlad » Sun Apr 14, 2019 5:52 pm

B_Little wrote:TW has learnt a hell of a lot this season about managing a squad and footy finances. If TW is here next season I think will see a player budget used with real purpose. Also player budget savings by making much more use of the loan market. Getting quality players from loan signings and on the cheap. This mix could make for a good season in term of a cup run, climbing up the league table and keeping finances in check.

I believe this season was a massive learning curve that be a big benefit going into next season. Nothing gained from changing the team management team again.

Darlo were outstanding yesterday. Boston could not cope and were out of their depth.

Up The Darlo
Are you THE brian little by any chance
I may not live in the north east anymore but i still support the north east teams

Darlo_Pete
Posts: 11859
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:13 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Darlo_Pete » Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:29 pm

B_Little wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:43 am
TW has learnt a hell of a lot this season about managing a squad and footy finances. If TW is here next season I think will see a player budget used with real purpose. Also player budget savings by making much more use of the loan market. Getting quality players from loan signings and on the cheap. This mix could make for a good season in term of a cup run, climbing up the league table and keeping finances in check.

I believe this season was a massive learning curve that be a big benefit going into next season. Nothing gained from changing the team management team again.

Darlo were outstanding yesterday. Boston could not cope and were out of their depth.

Up The Darlo
Can't argue with much of that. Yes he has made mistakes, but I still believe that he is improving and next season we will see a vastly improved performance. Now is not the time to change captains.

User avatar
Geordie Quaker
Posts: 585
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 9:32 am
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: See Username

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Geordie Quaker » Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:20 pm

I assume that by 'improving' you are isolating the last two matches alone? What other possible metric coudl you be using to suggest that he is getting better as a manager?

Those determined to keep Wright for next season seem to be basing it one thing: hope.

User avatar
don'tbuythesun
Posts: 1556
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:24 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by don'tbuythesun » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:00 am

By Captains I presume you mean managers? Now is exactly the time to make changes with the whole summer to plan and organise for the next season.

Beano
Posts: 1300
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:33 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Beano » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:10 am

Geordie Quaker wrote:I assume that by 'improving' you are isolating the last two matches alone? What other possible metric coudl you be using to suggest that he is getting better as a manager?

Those determined to keep Wright for next season seem to be basing it one thing: hope.
Hope of a weekend on the drink with Tommy in Eindhoven.

User avatar
grimsbyquaker
Posts: 349
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 4:03 pm
Team Supported: Darlington FC
Location: 53°22'N, 0°01'W

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by grimsbyquaker » Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:21 am

When we click we play some great stuff. I get the points made above but I can accept that inconsistency is part and parcel of life in non-league unless you are big-spenders with significant resources at your disposal. Anybody can beat anybody in this league. Next season is a worry in that three weak teams will go down and potentially be replaced by three bigger hitters. That said there’s nobody out there guaranteed to build a successful squad on our budget and who has a good connection with the club/area. If we were top 10 but playing awful stuff and grinding out 1-0s people would be happy/queue up at the turnstiles either. I think a lot of the reduced sales etc are more down to us finding a level and being stuck here and the realisation of our ceiling rather than just being about TW. Some Darlo ‘fans’ sound like the Boro phone-in moaners ‘I’m not renewing if he’s here next year’ etc

spen666
Posts: 1564
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:12 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by spen666 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:43 am

Darlo_Pete wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:29 pm
B_Little wrote:
Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:43 am
TW has learnt a hell of a lot this season about managing a squad and footy finances. If TW is here next season I think will see a player budget used with real purpose. Also player budget savings by making much more use of the loan market. Getting quality players from loan signings and on the cheap. This mix could make for a good season in term of a cup run, climbing up the league table and keeping finances in check.

I believe this season was a massive learning curve that be a big benefit going into next season. Nothing gained from changing the team management team again.

Darlo were outstanding yesterday. Boston could not cope and were out of their depth.

Up The Darlo
Can't argue with much of that. Yes he has made mistakes, but I still believe that he is improving and next season we will see a vastly improved performance. Now is not the time to change captains.
IF (and only if)any club are going to make a change, then now is the perfect time so the new manager has the whole summer to assemble and mould his own sife and hit the ground running.

The worst time is a few games into a new season, when the new manager has no chance to bring in his players or work with them without games coming thick and fast

Yarblockos
Posts: 612
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2015 9:19 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Yarblockos » Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:38 am

A manager is not judged on isolated matches. The fact that a side can win and play well occasionally does not mean that Tommy "has proven he can do it but just needs to find consistency". It shows that Tommy can't put together a side that is consistent, that can gets results and move up the table. He hasn't been able to put a side together that is anywhere near the play-offs. His sides rarely win, lose more than they win, concede a lot of goals, and as a consequence they are 5th bottom of the league. He has proven he can't do it.

User avatar
loan_star
Posts: 6066
Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:01 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by loan_star » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:37 am

Yarblockos wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:38 am
A manager is not judged on isolated matches. The fact that a side can win and play well occasionally does not mean that Tommy "has proven he can do it but just needs to find consistency". It shows that Tommy can't put together a side that is consistent, that can gets results and move up the table. He hasn't been able to put a side together that is anywhere near the play-offs. His sides rarely win, lose more than they win, concede a lot of goals, and as a consequence they are 5th bottom of the league. He has proven he can't do it.
Would you be happy with Jason Ainsley as manager? Someone who has a virtual blank cheque at the start of the season and can get new players in to create even more competition, yet has proven that even that sort of set up does not guarantee anything?
For me the biggest issue with Wright is that he failed to get a settled formation early in the season and tried to shoehorn players in rather than get the best formation that suited most of his players instead of getting all the name players in. Its the poor run at the start of the season that sent crowds down and forced the budget cuts and the weaker teams we had to put out until the loanees were brought in.
In his favour is his academy work, his willing to work under whatever constraints are put upon him and he obviously has an eye for decent young players. Any replacement manager has to have these attributes and more if we are to progress under the current ownership set up.

JE93
Posts: 1191
Joined: Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:48 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by JE93 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:14 pm

Problem for me is, I don't see where he is learning. We don't have an effective defensive unit. He has consistently failed to coach this into the players and the way we play. In reality we should have been 2-0 down at half-time v Boston. He gets plaudits for changing it at half time, but did he seriously think Nicholson, Thompson and Henshall were our best attacking options? We have chopped and changed formations and players all season. Player signings don't seem to be based on playing a certain way. He deserves credit for his work with the academy but I believe this work forms part of Wright and Whites remuneration so I'd expect them to do it.

I think Tommy is forever trying to be too clever. Trying to adapt too much to what the opposition is going to do. So much so that we never have a settled team or formation because he's trying to counter act what the opposition are trying to do. Rather than just playing to our strengths. Add to that he's had more than a few PR gaffs this season.

Best time for a clean break is at the start of the summer let the new manager come in with a plan for how they will adapt the squad and give them a full pre season to implement it. Worst decision would be going into next season thinking the manager has 10 games to impress. By which point the budget is spent, we probably can't afford to Sack them and there is little scope to change things. Fresh impetus over the summer to galvanize the supporter base. Get the feel good factor back. Have a couple of summer events for fans to meet the new management and go into the next season with renewed hope.

More generally I think as a club we're a little lost. In the first 5 years it was all project promotion and getting back to darlo. Now both have been achieved, who are we? What do we want next? This isn't helped by the ongoing BM v Sporting village saga which makes it difficult for the club to lay down permanent roots. I think in general there needs to be a strategy update that says currently we are X, in five years we want to be Y and here are the 3-5 objectives we need to complete to get there.

User avatar
divas
Posts: 12881
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 1:38 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by divas » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:20 pm

JE93 wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:14 pm
More generally I think as a club we're a little lost. In the first 5 years it was all project promotion and getting back to darlo. Now both have been achieved, who are we? What do we want next? This isn't helped by the ongoing BM v Sporting village saga which makes it difficult for the club to lay down permanent roots. I think in general there needs to be a strategy update that says currently we are X, in five years we want to be Y and here are the 3-5 objectives we need to complete to get there.
It’s already noted and being worked on

LoidLucan
Posts: 2826
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:29 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by LoidLucan » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:39 pm

I get why some people want to keep TW on because I've also sometimes been ambivalent about him. There have been games when we have played well (although often only for part of a match) on the front foot and picked teams apart, as in the second half on Saturday. But just when you thought we had turned a corner, we always seemed to take two steps back again.

There have been a lot of games in which we have been dreadful or just fell apart when in front and looked leaderless and without character, spirit, organisation and a proper gameplan. TW's 18 months in charge seem to have been characterised by slumps towards the bottom of the league and struggling to claw ourselves away. I had real fears that he would take us down before the slumps were halted.

What I don't see is signs that we are progressing. There were too many mistakes made in key positions in the summer recruitment and it looks like we'll be having to piece it all together again this summer whoever is in charge. The budget was in the main poorly spent, there's no getting away from it and we have suffered ever since. You'll always struggle if you've got it wrong with your keeper, a central defender, central midfielder and centre forward.

The other problem is that we've reached a situation where most of our fans don't believe we are progressing under TW and have lost faith in him to take us forward. That's clear from any conversations you have with fans, home and away. A lot don't feel confident he would get summer recruitment right this time and deliver some consistency. And that could well be reflected in income levels should he be in charge next season. A new manager could help to galvanise things and give us some impetus because this season has been marked by relegation fears, falling income and apathy.

Big decision to be made and if we make a change we'll need to make sure a recruitment process identifies the right man with the right credentials, experience, background and contacts to take us forward. Not easy but there would be a realistic target out there who is right for us.
Last edited by LoidLucan on Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
divas
Posts: 12881
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 1:38 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by divas » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:45 pm

Well summed up LL

bga
Posts: 1231
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:18 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by bga » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:19 pm

loan_star wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:37 am
Yarblockos wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:38 am
A manager is not judged on isolated matches. The fact that a side can win and play well occasionally does not mean that Tommy "has proven he can do it but just needs to find consistency". It shows that Tommy can't put together a side that is consistent, that can gets results and move up the table. He hasn't been able to put a side together that is anywhere near the play-offs. His sides rarely win, lose more than they win, concede a lot of goals, and as a consequence they are 5th bottom of the league. He has proven he can't do it.
Would you be happy with Jason Ainsley as manager? Someone who has a virtual blank cheque at the start of the season and can get new players in to create even more competition, yet has proven that even that sort of set up does not guarantee anything?
For me the biggest issue with Wright is that he failed to get a settled formation early in the season and tried to shoehorn players in rather than get the best formation that suited most of his players instead of getting all the name players in. Its the poor run at the start of the season that sent crowds down and forced the budget cuts and the weaker teams we had to put out until the loanees were brought in.
In his favour is his academy work, his willing to work under whatever constraints are put upon him and he obviously has an eye for decent young players. Any replacement manager has to have these attributes and more if we are to progress under the current ownership set up.
".....has an eye for decent young players"...…...Like who? Glover has not made the breakthrough if indeed he ever will. If you refer to the Loans TW has brought in, I think it is fair to say their parent Club has recognised their talent not TW!

Mister e
Posts: 84
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 3:08 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Mister e » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:45 pm

A lot of people having a go at Tommy criticise his cup record also but in fairness his three draws have been Harrogate town top of the league at the time Bradford park avenue also league leaders and then a Telford united side who went on to win ties away at Hartlepool spennymoor Solihull and took Leyton Orient to the wire.

onewayup
Posts: 1632
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2009 6:02 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by onewayup » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:41 pm

LoidLucan, just who are you thinking about as a replacement, how much will it cost to bring him in and why if he is out there was he not considered /come forward when we were in the market for a manager after
Gray. Could be he is not out there after all.

Darlogramps
Posts: 4588
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:47 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Darlogramps » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:53 pm

onewayup wrote:LoidLucan, just who are you thinking about as a replacement, how much will it cost to bring him in and why if he is out there was he not considered /come forward when we were in the market for a manager after
Gray. Could be he is not out there after all.
This rubbish again.

It's an argument that's been debunked time and time again. There are numerous threads listing realistic potential targets and we really don't need to go over them again.

We appointed Wright 18 months ago. Individuals' circumstances will have changed.

If you're seriously trying to argue that TW, with one relegation on his CV and chronic underperformance for three consecutive seasons, is the best standard of manager available, either the talent pool is woefully limited, or you're making rubbish up.

I'd venture it's the latter.




If ever you're bored or miserable:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlZohZoadGY

Beano
Posts: 1300
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:33 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Beano » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:08 pm

I want to also consider the club's transfer dealings:

David Ferguson - signed by Martin Gray on a free; sold by Tommy Wright for a fee.
Mark Beck - signed by Martin Gray on a free; sold by Tommy Wright for a fee.
Adam Bartlett - signed by Martin Gray on a free; sold by Tommy Wright for a fee.
Reece Styche - signed by Tommy Wright for a fee; sold by Tommy Wright for a fee.
Harvey Saunders - signed by Martin Gray; sold by Tommy Wright for a fee.
Josh Heaton - originally a target of Martin Gray, subsequently injured, signed by Tommy Wright when fit on a free, and sold by Tommy Wright for a fee.

LoidLucan
Posts: 2826
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:29 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by LoidLucan » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:35 pm

I think Ferguson had gone by the time Wright was appointed, Beck never played a game under TW and was gone a couple of weeks after him arriving along with Bartlett.
Last edited by LoidLucan on Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
divas
Posts: 12881
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 1:38 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by divas » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:41 pm

Ferguson also wasn’t free.

User avatar
loan_star
Posts: 6066
Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:01 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by loan_star » Mon Apr 15, 2019 4:09 pm

bga wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:19 pm
loan_star wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:37 am

Would you be happy with Jason Ainsley as manager? Someone who has a virtual blank cheque at the start of the season and can get new players in to create even more competition, yet has proven that even that sort of set up does not guarantee anything?
For me the biggest issue with Wright is that he failed to get a settled formation early in the season and tried to shoehorn players in rather than get the best formation that suited most of his players instead of getting all the name players in. Its the poor run at the start of the season that sent crowds down and forced the budget cuts and the weaker teams we had to put out until the loanees were brought in.
In his favour is his academy work, his willing to work under whatever constraints are put upon him and he obviously has an eye for decent young players. Any replacement manager has to have these attributes and more if we are to progress under the current ownership set up.
".....has an eye for decent young players"...…...Like who? Glover has not made the breakthrough if indeed he ever will. If you refer to the Loans TW has brought in, I think it is fair to say their parent Club has recognised their talent not TW!
Nicholson and Elliott are not bad players. Dont you think that Wright actually takes in games to look at potential signings whether on loan or permanent deals before approaching the parent club about a transfer? Or do you think he just rings clubs up and says send me a defender please?
JE93 wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:14 pm
but did he seriously think Nicholson, Thompson and Henshall were our best attacking options?
Nicholson and Thompson are our top scorers so yes those two are arguably our best attacking options. Henshall was picked to play out wide in a formation that should have got the best out of him but he didnt deliver again. I doubt we will see him again.

Mister e
Posts: 84
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 3:08 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Mister e » Mon Apr 15, 2019 4:18 pm

Lord Lucan mark beck did play under Tommy Wright we lost him because somebody leaked the news about a release clause in his contract to Harrogate town manager Simon weaver.

Beano
Posts: 1300
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:33 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: TW - Learning His Trade

Post by Beano » Mon Apr 15, 2019 4:25 pm

LoidLucan wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:35 pm
I think Ferguson had gone by the time Wright was appointed, Beck never played a game under TW and was gone a couple of weeks after him arriving along with Bartlett.
My point was to show that the supposed fee generation from players, which is mainly down to circumstances and affordability, was from the benefit of Gray's signings not Tommy's.

I was convinced Beck did play a game, although it is irrelevant, as the point is I can't see these younger players Tommy has signed and sold for profit.

Post Reply