October 3rd

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onewayup
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Re: October 3rd

Post by onewayup » Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:56 am

It's an absolute mi mine field trying to get this going,
All football clubs will need to check and check again as the rules change every day, my gut feeling is we won't get underway 3 oct, if at all this year.
I really hope I'm wrong but the demographics suggest otherwise.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: October 3rd

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:56 am

AndyPark wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:51 am
Darlo_Pete wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:20 am
I just can't see how the season can start if areas of the North are being locked down or partially locked down. The reality is that we are facing a second surge in Coronavirus & that could end any chance of a new season started this season. Sorry for being so gloomy, but I think people who are hoping for an October return are not facing the reality of the situation. Hope I'm wrong of course.
How can we be facing a 2nd surge, when the 1st phase never ended?
To me there was an improvement, but when we tried to get back a little normality it's rearing up again. It's impossible to organise all sorts of things, let alone a non league football season, however my main point re football is should a league be able to force a start date but at the same time impose restrictions that would mean many teams would lose money each game?

I'm on about crowd restrictions.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

eek
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Re: October 3rd

Post by eek » Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:54 am

super_les_mcjannet wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:27 am
Well at the moment we only have 43 teams between North and South. Now they don’t look like promoting a team from Step 3 so we are short.

If Bury get dropped in North Division then we will have 44 teams and 22 for each, of which Brackley or Gloucester would move South. If Bury aren’t dropped into us and no team comes up from step 3 then we are one short.

We are likely to stay with 22 and south reduced to 21 as we get Fylde and Chorley but who knows how they do it. So we could be down to 20 home games but it looks unlikely.
Bury don't exist anymore - and Bury AFC are joining the North West League in their first division see https://talksport.com/football/735647/b ... ue-system/

lo36789
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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:08 am

Bury still do exist unfortunately its a zombie entity with no players or staff and no membership to a league but still hold that "golden share" oh and a substantial amount of debt.

I say unfortunately because for as long as the zombie club exists Bury AFC will not be as successful as they could be.

eek
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Re: October 3rd

Post by eek » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:11 am

lo36789 wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:08 am
Bury still do exist unfortunately its a zombie entity with no players or staff and no membership to a league but still hold that "golden share" oh and a substantial amount of debt.
So while there is a legal entity that still exists there is no way they will be playing football. The next time we see Bury (assuming we remain in the NLN) will be in 4 years time assuming Bury win successive promotions - given their plans I expect them to get to the Northern Premier League fairly quickly.

lo36789
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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:16 am

Probably not but you can see on twitter that the two existing in parallel is splitting the fan base.

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dfc4me
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Re: October 3rd

Post by dfc4me » Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:47 am

Surely instead of a one size fits all solution each club should be working with local health officials, taking into account things like the layout of the ground rather than just using a percentage of capacity. For eg a ground that is very open is likely to be safer than a ground that is enclosed on all 4 sides.

super_les_mcjannet
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Re: October 3rd

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:48 am

eek wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:54 am
super_les_mcjannet wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:27 am
Well at the moment we only have 43 teams between North and South. Now they don’t look like promoting a team from Step 3 so we are short.

If Bury get dropped in North Division then we will have 44 teams and 22 for each, of which Brackley or Gloucester would move South. If Bury aren’t dropped into us and no team comes up from step 3 then we are one short.

We are likely to stay with 22 and south reduced to 21 as we get Fylde and Chorley but who knows how they do it. So we could be down to 20 home games but it looks unlikely.
Bury don't exist anymore - and Bury AFC are joining the North West League in their first division see https://talksport.com/football/735647/b ... ue-system/
As mentioned by Lo it's unlikely we will get Bury however their future is possibly up for decision today I believe.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53555576

It's all down to the National League and whether they accept Bury currently and then where they would be placed.

al_quaker
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Re: October 3rd

Post by al_quaker » Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:13 pm

I wonder what the impact (if any) of todays reversal on some of the planned loosening of restrictions and trial sporting events with crowds will have on the planned start date. Chris Whitty effectively said 'this is as far as we can go' in terms of opening things up.

Old Git
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Re: October 3rd

Post by Old Git » Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:54 pm

al_quaker wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:13 pm
I wonder what the impact (if any) of todays reversal on some of the planned loosening of restrictions and trial sporting events with crowds will have on the planned start date. Chris Whitty effectively said 'this is as far as we can go' in terms of opening things up.
Sadly today’s announcement illustrates just how fragile the situation is currently. I hope that I am being too pessimistic but I cannot see football returning in the foreseeable future in front of paying spectators. That would surely mean our League will be unlikely to start especially as we will be moving into Winter when it seems things may worsen Coronavirus wise. Hope I am wrong but it seems possible we may have to wait for a vaccine to be available before we can confidently plan for a restart.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:28 pm

Comms has just come out. Teams from Blackburn and Darwen are not allowed to participate in friendlies like all other teams in the country are.

Also references that boroughs of Oldham, Rochdale, Pendle, Burnley, Rossendale and Hyndburn are on notice given current situation so expect they will come next unless their current trajectories suddenly changes.

Excerpt from the Comms...https://twitter.com/BlackburnLeague/sta ... 70016?s=19

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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 12:09 pm

The FA Cup starting in September is massively in doubt now. The North West Counties have met and said they can't start without spectators so they don't expect to start until October now.

That would mean no earlier rounds of the FA Cup taking place unless the FA decide to ignore their pleas.

Darlopartisan
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Re: October 3rd

Post by Darlopartisan » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:42 pm

When or have we started training yet? Seen different teams from different leagues already playing preseason games, anyone

Darlofan97
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Re: October 3rd

Post by Darlofan97 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:46 pm

We won’t be this early. Pre-season typically starts 5/6 weeks before the new season start date.

AndyPark
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Re: October 3rd

Post by AndyPark » Sat Aug 01, 2020 10:40 pm

We started pre-season last Saturday apparently.

Darlofan97
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Re: October 3rd

Post by Darlofan97 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:00 pm

Alun mentioned last Saturday was a possibility, but that was before October 3rd was announced as the start date.

It will be the longest pre-season of their careers if they began last Saturday!

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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 6:51 am

I know clubs that have been going for a good few weeks now. FC United have been posting videos of small groups (6) training for the past month. I see Bolton Wanderers played Atherton Colls so it has been clubs from all levels.

This Saturday was the first time competitive games (friendlies) have been allowed so most clubs have wanted to get back as soon as.

Got to remember though that the FA have still stuck a 5th September date on the first extra prelim of the FA Cup and that is a set date not a "no earlier than..."- guess as there hasn't been a draw get many clubs have to assume they will play on that day.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by bigdavethemaddog » Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:01 am

lo36789 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 6:51 am
I know clubs that have been going for a good few weeks now. FC United have been posting videos of small groups (6) training for the past month. I see Bolton Wanderers played Atherton Colls so it has been clubs from all levels.

This Saturday was the first time competitive games (friendlies) have been allowed so most clubs have wanted to get back as soon as.

Got to remember though that the FA have still stuck a 5th September date on the first extra prelim of the FA Cup and that is a set date not a "no earlier than..."- guess as there hasn't been a draw get many clubs have to assume they will play on that day.
from what ive seen elsewhere i believe the FA Cup draw is tomorrow

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: October 3rd

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:43 am

Surely starting pre season training means that players will need to be paid? How could we do this when the season starts (or is supposed to start) so late?
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

lo36789
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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:53 am

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:43 am
Surely starting pre season training means that players will need to be paid? How could we do this when the season starts (or is supposed to start) so late?
Nope don't think so players are effectively paid a seasons contract in instalments. Instalments start from the beginning of the competitive plating season.

That said I not sure how the contract is written but I am not sure if that is strictly "our" season or the season for anybody in the national league system.

al_quaker
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Re: October 3rd

Post by al_quaker » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:29 am

Well the Maguire signing has eased my concerns about the finances somewhat. I can't imagine it would have been approved if there were financial concerns regarding potential reduced capacities. Which is good!

Old Git
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Re: October 3rd

Post by Old Git » Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:09 am

Listening to AA interview with Ray it seems he is holding back on bringing the players back in for pre season training as he does not want them to be stale when/ if the season starts. At the moment he is trusting them to look after themselves. Could be a wise move as when the season does begin there are likely to be a lot of matches to squeeze in. Plenty of time even if October 3rd start date can be achieved.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:06 pm

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:43 am
Surely starting pre season training means that players will need to be paid? How could we do this when the season starts (or is supposed to start) so late?
No.

Contracts start the first game of the new season, whenever that is.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:08 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:53 am
theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:43 am
Surely starting pre season training means that players will need to be paid? How could we do this when the season starts (or is supposed to start) so late?
Nope don't think so players are effectively paid a seasons contract in instalments. Instalments start from the beginning of the competitive plating season.

That said I not sure how the contract is written but I am not sure if that is strictly "our" season or the season for anybody in the national league system.
All of the clubs will start at the same time within the National League North, so that won’t be an issue. The contracts will relate to the club’s situation anyway as the contract is with the club & not the league.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by al_quaker » Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:21 am

On the subject of the new season, I see we're entering next seasons FA Trophy at the second round (https://darlingtonfc.co.uk/news/quakers ... -fa-trophy). Not entirely sure why!

In worse news, FA cup prize money has been halved. So, as our opening game of the season is schedule to be FA Cup 2QR, and may well be behind closed doors or vastly reduced crowds. A money spinner...

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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:39 am

I suspect it must be because clubs at our level at given a bye based on PPG, or clubs are required to enter at the first round based on PPG.

Vauxhall Motors who mathematically won promotion last season from Step 6 last season were pulled out of the draw to be excluded from the FA Cup this season...

157 clubs at Step 6 and below paid the FA £140 each to be pulled out of a draw to be excluded.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by spen666 » Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:07 am

al_quaker wrote:
Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:21 am
On the subject of the new season, I see we're entering next seasons FA Trophy at the second round (https://darlingtonfc.co.uk/news/quakers ... -fa-trophy). Not entirely sure why!

In worse news, FA cup prize money has been halved. So, as our opening game of the season is schedule to be FA Cup 2QR, and may well be behind closed doors or vastly reduced crowds. A money spinner...
FA Trophy format had changed. There used to be 4 rounds proper before semis. Now it seems there are 6 rounds proper.

National League sides enter at 3rd round proper instead of first round proper

NLN & NLS enter 2nd round.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by jjljks » Tue Aug 04, 2020 9:53 am

spen666 wrote:
Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:07 am
al_quaker wrote:
Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:21 am
On the subject of the new season, I see we're entering next seasons FA Trophy at the second round (https://darlingtonfc.co.uk/news/quakers ... -fa-trophy). Not entirely sure why!

In worse news, FA cup prize money has been halved. So, as our opening game of the season is schedule to be FA Cup 2QR, and may well be behind closed doors or vastly reduced crowds. A money spinner...
FA Trophy format had changed. There used to be 4 rounds proper before semis. Now it seems there are 6 rounds proper.

National League sides enter at 3rd round proper instead of first round proper

NLN & NLS enter 2nd round.
Simple remedy to prize money being halved, we just have to go twice as far as last season! ;)

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Re: October 3rd

Post by lo36789 » Tue Aug 04, 2020 9:53 am

spen666 wrote:
Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:07 am
FA Trophy format had changed. There used to be 4 rounds proper before semis. Now it seems there are 6 rounds proper.

National League sides enter at 3rd round proper instead of first round proper

NLN & NLS enter 2nd round.
The article states we have been given an exemption though?

Surely if we just enter at the 2nd round that isn't a) news and b) an exemption it is just entering at the stage that is predetermined.

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Re: October 3rd

Post by spen666 » Tue Aug 04, 2020 10:06 am

lo36789 wrote:
Tue Aug 04, 2020 9:53 am
spen666 wrote:
Tue Aug 04, 2020 8:07 am
FA Trophy format had changed. There used to be 4 rounds proper before semis. Now it seems there are 6 rounds proper.

National League sides enter at 3rd round proper instead of first round proper

NLN & NLS enter 2nd round.
The article states we have been given an exemption though?

Surely if we just enter at the 2nd round that isn't a) news and b) an exemption it is just entering at the stage that is predetermined.
All NLN and NLS sides now come in at Round 2 instead of 3rd Qualifying round. There used to be 4 rounds proper then semis and final. now its 6 rounds proper, then semis and finals. The FA have basically renamed the rounds. All NLN & NLS come in at same stage as last time (ie round before National League & Round after Step 3 leagues). All that has changed is the names of the rounds

Think you are trying to make the term "exemption" into something the FA don't mean. All NLN & NLS clubs are exempt to 2nd round this year. All National League Clubs are exempt to the 3rd round ( according to FA)


http://www.thefa.com/-/media/thefacom-n ... tions.ashx
Last edited by spen666 on Tue Aug 04, 2020 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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