Ground share

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lo36789
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Re: Ground share

Post by lo36789 » Sat Aug 15, 2020 8:08 pm

LoidLucan wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:13 pm
Harrogate have chosen to tear up their pitch and groundshare for as long as it takes because they want to play at a higher level and they are not being asked to repay the huge grants they have been given. They could have just opted to stay in the National League, it was their choice not to. You are stretching things to a ridiculous level when a club like Darlington seeks a temporary move to get through a crisis with every intention to move back once it is over.
Does the if you refuse / can't be promoted then you are relegated rule apply to all steps?

Tbf the grants tend to stipulate that football must continue to be played at a venue a 4G may have come with requirements for community use outside of matchday - if they fitted a hybrid pitch in its place they could probably still meet that.

lo36789
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Re: Ground share

Post by lo36789 » Sat Aug 15, 2020 8:08 pm

spen666 wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 2:59 pm
One point I have not seen mentioned ( and I don't know the answer) that may affect a temporary move to the Arena, is how this could affect any potential liability to repay the grants previously obtained.

The grants were to improve BM and on basis DFC would play there.

A move to the Arena would breach that requirement & could trigger a requirement to repay some/all of the grants. This is what did for Newcastle Blue Star when they moved from The Wheatsheaf Ground to Kingston Park.

It would be hoped that the bodies who made the grants would look upon a temporary move from BM as not a breach in the circumstances. However the argument against waiving any breach is that it was a choice of the club to move. It was not a case of BM not being available.

As the amounts of grants to be repaid reduces on a sliding scale, it may well be any amount if it had to be repaid would be small
The Youth team could play there and we would be fine as think someone has said before the only requirement is that it is used for football.

bigdavethemaddog
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Re: Ground share

Post by bigdavethemaddog » Sat Aug 15, 2020 9:43 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 8:08 pm
LoidLucan wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:13 pm
Harrogate have chosen to tear up their pitch and groundshare for as long as it takes because they want to play at a higher level and they are not being asked to repay the huge grants they have been given. They could have just opted to stay in the National League, it was their choice not to. You are stretching things to a ridiculous level when a club like Darlington seeks a temporary move to get through a crisis with every intention to move back once it is over.
Does the if you refuse / can't be promoted then you are relegated rule apply to all steps?

Tbf the grants tend to stipulate that football must continue to be played at a venue a 4G may have come with requirements for community use outside of matchday - if they fitted a hybrid pitch in its place they could probably still meet that.
if the EFL allowed plastic pitches then Harrogate wouldnt have any issues as they addressed the capacity issue.

lo36789
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Re: Ground share

Post by lo36789 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 8:30 am

Ghost_Of_1883 wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:57 pm
If there's a secret plan to move us to the Arena using covid as the excuse, then force us to stay there - as one or two of the most paranoid are thinking, then they aren't going to let that cat out of the bag and explain it now are they?
I was reading the Facebook comments about this and made we wonder.

If we have gone public with this before the request is that because we expect a challenge or know there will be one (we are clearly trying to generate public / media support). It made me think if we think it will be difficult.

"Why aren't we just saying to the league that we are moving there"

If we did that there would be no need to ask permission. If the groundshare agreement stacks up to FA requirements then they couldn't really say anything surely?

That makes me think we still couldn't and can't get primacy of tenure from MPR as we are clearly asking for special dispensation, and from the league not the FA who govern ground appropriateness, to play there "for the foreseeable"

And that is why there should be no concern this is an attempt to get a permanent move in under the guise of covid. We are clearly requiring special permissions to move there which would be a blocker to a permanent move.

EDJOHNS
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Re: Ground share

Post by EDJOHNS » Sun Aug 16, 2020 8:43 am

lo36789 wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 8:30 am
Ghost_Of_1883 wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:57 pm
If there's a secret plan to move us to the Arena using covid as the excuse, then force us to stay there - as one or two of the most paranoid are thinking, then they aren't going to let that cat out of the bag and explain it now are they?
I was reading the Facebook comments about this and made we wonder.

If we have gone public with this before the request is that because we expect a challenge or know there will be one (we are clearly trying to generate public / media support). It made me think if we think it will be difficult.

"Why aren't we just saying to the league that we are moving there"

If we did that there would be no need to ask permission. If the groundshare agreement stacks up to FA requirements then they couldn't really say anything surely?

That makes me think we still couldn't and can't get primacy of tenure from MPR as we are clearly asking for special dispensation, and from the league not the FA who govern ground appropriateness, to play there "for the foreseeable"

And that is why there should be no concern this is an attempt to get a permanent move in under the guise of covid. We are clearly requiring special permissions to move there which would be a blocker to a permanent move.
Nop. Put quite simply you are not allowed to move to a "temporary" home without good reason and permission.
If we said we were moving back permanently the rugby club solicitors and the grant authorities would be all over us like a bad rash.

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Re: Ground share

Post by onewayup » Sun Aug 16, 2020 9:15 am

All the postulateing on this subject is just that,DJ has more than enough experience dealing with things similar to this that i believe he has all areas covered, costings and viability would have been one of the first things he'd have discussed after speaking to DMPRC. One follows the other, you don't go in blind.
in DJ AND THE BOARD WE MUST TRUST,
IT'S TEMPORARY,

lo36789
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Re: Ground share

Post by lo36789 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 9:52 am

EDJOHNS wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 8:43 am
If we said we were moving back permanently the rugby club solicitors and the grant authorities would be all over us like a bad rash.
The rugby club wouldn't care if we kept paying for our license would they? In fact they would literally get money for nothing. Grant wise football just need to be played at the rugby club.

The point is if there is fear that this is some sort of plot to move permanently we would just do it because that would be easier than asking permission to move temporarily - and then we could permanently move back MP later.

There have to be fundamental hurdles to us being able to call the Arena our home ground so the theory that this is a covert permanent move do not work so anyone fearful of that simply shouldn't be.

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Re: Ground share

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 9:53 am

onewayup wrote:All the postulateing on this subject is just that,DJ has more than enough experience dealing with things similar to this that i believe he has all areas covered, costings and viability would have been one of the first things he'd have discussed after speaking to DMPRC. One follows the other, you don't go in blind.
in DJ AND THE BOARD WE MUST TRUST,
IT'S TEMPORARY,
Absolutely agree, total trust in DJ and the rest of the board.

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PierremontQuaker03
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Re: Ground share

Post by PierremontQuaker03 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 9:55 am

Yes we are a fan owned club, but let’s not be run by committee, let DJ get on with the job and assess the viability of all the options.


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Re: Ground share

Post by Darlo_Pete » Sun Aug 16, 2020 10:20 am

Like others I'm more than happy to return to the Arena. Leave it to DJ to sort out the details & get off his back. For those that won't go to a game at the Arena, hang your head in shame, call yourself Darlo fans. Obviously the few that are shielding I completely understand avoiding footie games until things return to normal & a vaccine is found.

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Re: Ground share

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 10:25 am

Darlo_Pete wrote:Like others I'm more than happy to return to the Arena. Leave it to DJ to sort out the details & get off his back. For those that won't go to a game at the Arena, hang your head in shame, call yourself Darlo fans. Obviously the few that are shielding I completely understand avoiding footie games until things return to normal & a vaccine is found.
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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Ground share

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:12 am

Darlo_Pete wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 10:20 am
Like others I'm more than happy to return to the Arena. Leave it to DJ to sort out the details & get off his back. For those that won't go to a game at the Arena, hang your head in shame, call yourself Darlo fans. Obviously the few that are shielding I completely understand avoiding footie games until things return to normal & a vaccine is found.
There will be a few who won’t go to The Arena but I suspect these numbers will be reversed by those who once tried a game at B.Meadows and didn’t return. Let’s remember, some people don’t like Blackwell Meadows.

Also, we surely will make more money at the Arena from hospitality and suchlike too.

I never wanted to leave Feethams and I didn’t like The Arena but a temporary move makes sense.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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Spratts corner
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Re: Ground share

Post by Spratts corner » Sun Aug 16, 2020 12:10 pm

I liked Feethams, i liked The Arena, i liked Bishop, i like Blackwell. Why? Because thats where DARLO play!!! Surely that's the important thing

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HarrytheQuaker
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Re: Ground share

Post by HarrytheQuaker » Sun Aug 16, 2020 12:44 pm

Spratts corner wrote:I liked Feethams, i liked The Arena, i liked Bishop, i like Blackwell. Why? Because thats where DARLO play!!! Surely that's the important thing
That is the best reply..My thoughts exactly

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Re: Ground share

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 12:52 pm

HarrytheQuaker wrote:
Spratts corner wrote:I liked Feethams, i liked The Arena, i liked Bishop, i like Blackwell. Why? Because thats where DARLO play!!! Surely that's the important thing
That is the best reply..My thoughts exactly

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jjljks
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Re: Ground share

Post by jjljks » Sun Aug 16, 2020 1:53 pm

Do the grant conditions specify what kind of football must be played at BM? Obviously it will host rugby football🤔

cbh89f
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Re: Ground share

Post by cbh89f » Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:48 pm

Is there any logical reason that some people hate the Arena .
Obviously there were bad times there due to unscrupulous characters who had no interest in the Football Club .
The Arena in itself was not and is not the problem .
The place is not jinxed or haunted .
To state that you would never go there again is completely illogical .
It’s like saying my ex wife used to live in Richmond so I’m never going there again...

norwich darlo
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Re: Ground share

Post by norwich darlo » Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:29 pm

cbh89f wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:48 pm
Is there any logical reason that some people hate the Arena .
Obviously there were bad times there due to unscrupulous characters who had no interest in the Football Club .
The Arena in itself was not and is not the problem .
The place is not jinxed or haunted .
To state that you would never go there again is completely illogical .
It’s like saying my ex wife used to live in Richmond so I’m never going there again...
If I found out where my ex is living I'd bomb the place!...I'm not bitter after all I am over it.

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Makka Pakka
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Re: Ground share

Post by Makka Pakka » Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:37 pm

The Arena had higher running costs than a sensibly sized stadium for sure, but the flip side to that is it had greater revenue generating potential. The 1st admin was surely due to the building costs so, yes, it was responsible. The 2 subsequent admins were due to chairmen spending beyond the club's means...but... those chairmen would not have come near the football club were it not for the scoundrel-magnet that was the Arena so it was indirectly responsible.
"At a meeting held at the Grammar School on Friday last - Mr Phillip Wood M.A., in the chair - it was resolved to form an Association Football Club for Darlington and neighbourhood. The opinions of those present were so unanimous as to the desirability of this step, that a committee was formed to complete the organisation of the club, and Mr Craven, 17, Garden Street, was appointed secretary pro tem." - The Northern Echo, Monday 23rd July 1883

quakersfan
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Re: Ground share

Post by quakersfan » Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:36 am

jjljks wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 1:53 pm
Do the grant conditions specify what kind of football must be played at BM? Obviously it will host rugby football🤔
Apparently it can be any football at any level and there needs to be access from the main road. The grant if it ever was to be paid back lasts 10 years so we only have 5/6 years left.

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Re: Ground share

Post by EDJOHNS » Mon Aug 17, 2020 7:51 am

quakersfan wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:36 am
jjljks wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 1:53 pm
Do the grant conditions specify what kind of football must be played at BM? Obviously it will host rugby football🤔
Apparently it can be any football at any level and there needs to be access from the main road. The grant if it ever was to be paid back lasts 10 years so we only have 5/6 years left.
You sure it is 10 years? Thought I read somewhere it is 5 years

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Re: Ground share

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Mon Aug 17, 2020 8:00 am

DJ just been interviewed on Sky news , came across very well and just wonder if this exposure may help our cause.

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jjljks
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Re: Ground share

Post by jjljks » Mon Aug 17, 2020 8:32 am

Did DJ say if he had heard back from the NL on our request to temporarily relocate to the Arena?

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Re: Ground share

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Mon Aug 17, 2020 8:37 am

jjljks wrote:Did DJ say if he had heard back from the NL on our request to temporarily relocate to the Arena?
No, still waiting to hear.

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LoidLucan
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Re: Ground share

Post by LoidLucan » Mon Aug 17, 2020 9:17 am

We should get that Sky News presenter Niall Paterson invited along to a game. He said at the end of the interview that he's a Celtic fan but looking for an English team to support and he may take a close look at Darlo :clap:

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Re: Ground share

Post by AndyPark » Mon Aug 17, 2020 10:07 am

Certainly getting a lot of exposure at the minute, can't be a bad thing at all :clap:
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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Ground share

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Mon Aug 17, 2020 10:46 am

AndyPark wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 10:07 am
Certainly getting a lot of exposure at the minute, can't be a bad thing at all :clap:
Will you be coming back to join us Andy ??
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Ground share

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Mon Aug 17, 2020 11:01 am

I reckon D.J views this situation as serious.

If we don't get permission to move it will force us into a money losing situation, and also alienate more than half of our fanbase.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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QUAKERMAN2
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Re: Ground share

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Mon Aug 17, 2020 11:20 am

theoriginalfatcat wrote:I reckon D.J views this situation as serious.

If we don't get permission to move it will force us into a money losing situation, and also alienate more than half of our fanbase.
Common sense should prevail here, we are not asking to play out of town and the Arena is perfect for distancing whilst not having the impossible task of deciding who can attend games at BM.Only allowing 17% of ground capacity is a nightmare at any level,not just non league, and there is no logical reason to refuse our request.But you have to hold your breath with those at the top ....you just don’t know which way this will go but fingers crossed we will get the green light.


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Re: Ground share

Post by spen666 » Mon Aug 17, 2020 11:46 am

EDJOHNS wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 7:51 am
quakersfan wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:36 am
jjljks wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 1:53 pm
Do the grant conditions specify what kind of football must be played at BM? Obviously it will host rugby football🤔
Apparently it can be any football at any level and there needs to be access from the main road. The grant if it ever was to be paid back lasts 10 years so we only have 5/6 years left.
You sure it is 10 years? Thought I read somewhere it is 5 years


I didn't think it was as long as 10 years, but depends on who made grants as different organizations will have different time periods and different rules

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