impact on ground capacity

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lo36789
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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by lo36789 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:38 pm

Quaker85 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:16 pm
Look at the pictures from the Stockton v Shildon cup match tonight. 300 allowed in and the shed is as full as it always is. No social distancing being observed in there tonight!
People have to take responsibility for their own actions there will be enough space provided for them to distance.

It will be the same when we have games some people will still congregate together, there will be groups who will make up that they are in a bubble together if challenged.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by Quaker85 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:49 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Quaker85 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:16 pm
Look at the pictures from the Stockton v Shildon cup match tonight. 300 allowed in and the shed is as full as it always is. No social distancing being observed in there tonight!
People have to take responsibility for their own actions there will be enough space provided for them to distance.

It will be the same when we have games some people will still congregate together, there will be groups who will make up that they are in a bubble together if challenged.
True but if the government can see that guidelines aren’t being observed coupled with high R rates and that will be it, gates closed.


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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by quakerste » Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:50 pm

Bishop game the majority are sheltering from the rain in the tin shed. Poor game.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by lo36789 » Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:52 am

Quaker85 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:49 pm
lo36789 wrote:
Quaker85 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:16 pm
Look at the pictures from the Stockton v Shildon cup match tonight. 300 allowed in and the shed is as full as it always is. No social distancing being observed in there tonight!
People have to take responsibility for their own actions there will be enough space provided for them to distance.

It will be the same when we have games some people will still congregate together, there will be groups who will make up that they are in a bubble together if challenged.
True but if the government can see that guidelines aren’t being observed coupled with high R rates and that will be it, gates closed.
Guidelines aren't being following in shops and pubs up and down the country and they remain open.

If R rates go up enough then that will be it but that is the same for everything.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by jjljks » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:32 am

R rates already spiking in some places, local restrictions imposed for example in Greater Manchester, Bolton, Blackburn already & a few mutterings about South Tyneside & Boro. Coincidentally, lot of (non-league) soccer clubs around there too, so can imagine HMG banning games in front of fans altogether. Very worrying for clubs who rely on gate receipts for their income.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by lo36789 » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:47 am

And the guidance from the FA to all clubs in the NLS is that local lockdowns are irrelevant to football and "continue as normal". Ask individuals to isolate if symptomatic or test positive but no need to isolate any others or apply other measures.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:04 am

lo36789 wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:47 am
And the guidance from the FA to all clubs in the NLS is that local lockdowns are irrelevant to football and "continue as normal". Ask individuals to isolate if symptomatic or test positive but no need to isolate any others or apply other measures.
Seems a bit strange. You can get an area where no one is allowed to go to another persons house, and other restrictions apply yet the local non league team can play as normal?
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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by onewayup » Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:31 am

Darlington at the moment is clear of coronavirus, If people follow the guidelines and use common sense while attending functions, football matches, and the like I think we will as save going to the matches as we would shopping or other activities, but it's down to the sence of the people, it's in the hands of the fans to keep the health Hygiene high, we all want to go and watch the games so let's be vigilant over these health guidelines. Maybe we can keep this VIRUS from spreading ,and get the football going again, I am having withdrawal symptoms it's tough on a Saturday .

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by HarrytheQuaker » Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:33 am

onewayup wrote:Darlington at the moment is clear of coronavirus, If people follow the guidelines and use common sense while attending functions, football matches, and the like I think we will as save going to the matches as we would shopping or other activities, but it's down to the sence of the people, it's in the hands of the fans to keep the health Hygiene high, we all want to go and watch the games so let's be vigilant over these health guidelines. Maybe we can keep this VIRUS from spreading ,and get the football going again, I am having withdrawal symptoms it's tough on a Saturday .
But not all people who attend live in Darlo and might unwittingly bring the virus with them and pass it on unwittingly to an other and so on and so on that's how it spreads as we know..So it's not as simple as to say Darlington is Corona free, yes it my be atm but it's like everywhere it's a risk when people travel... Its a difficult thing to manage

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by en passant » Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:02 am

HarrytheQuaker wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:33 am
onewayup wrote:Darlington at the moment is clear of coronavirus, If people follow the guidelines and use common sense while attending functions, football matches, and the like I think we will as save going to the matches as we would shopping or other activities, but it's down to the sence of the people, it's in the hands of the fans to keep the health Hygiene high, we all want to go and watch the games so let's be vigilant over these health guidelines. Maybe we can keep this VIRUS from spreading ,and get the football going again, I am having withdrawal symptoms it's tough on a Saturday .
But not all people who attend live in Darlo and might unwittingly bring the virus with them and pass it on unwittingly to an other and so on and so on that's how it spreads as we know..So it's not as simple as to say Darlington is Corona free, yes it my be atm but it's like everywhere it's a risk when people travel... Its a difficult thing to manage

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But surely people have been coming in and out of Darlington from outside the town for weeks. A few football fans will not be significant number when considered against those going up to Newcastle and over to Teesside to shop, travel into the town to shop and work, have gone on holiday, or travelled into and out of the town for the August Bank Holiday. There will be a risk, sure, but placed against other greater risks already in place it hardly seems credible that this would significantly up the rate of transfer.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by onewayup » Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:56 am

All I,m saying is following the guidelines and the transmission of the virus will be very much reduced, it really is simple protection will always beat infection if followed correctly,
So it's upto the people how they deal with it, common sense should always prevail.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by jjljks » Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:50 pm

onewayup wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:56 am
All I,m saying is following the guidelines and the transmission of the virus will be very much reduced, it really is simple protection will always beat infection if followed correctly,
So it's upto the people how they deal with it, common sense should always prevail.
The only thing wrong with that, is there's no such thing as common sense

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by quaker4life » Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:21 pm

Just become aware of this, apparently it was posted 4 days ago and does't appear to have been mentioned on here.
A statement from the National League:
The Chairman of the National League, Brian Barwick, has today written to The Rt Hon Oliver Dowden CBE MP, Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport to ask the Government to carefully consider how its pending decision on the return of fans to football grounds will affect its clubs, their employees, and local communities.

The National League has also asked the Government for permission to commence the new season on 3 October with fans in attendance with social distancing and other Covid secure measures in place.

Since the onset of the pandemic, the National League has closely adhered to Government policy and fully recognises the overwhelming necessity to protect people's health and well-being. Following the Prime Minister's announcement on 17 July that Government intended to bring back audiences in stadia from October each club has started to prepare for the 2020-21 season.

The National League has set the start date as 3 October, which is when 24 clubs would be due to play their first league match and a further 43 clubs are involved FA Cup ties.

In readiness for the safe return of spectators, National League clubs have calculated their ground's new socially-distanced capacity. Whilst crowds could be accommodated up to a level of 20-30% of each stadium's normal capacity in accordance with the Sports Grounds Safety Authority guidance, the National League has asked the Government to allow up to 1,000 spectators in all grounds from October as a temporary solution that is validated by the Government’s approved pilot events conducted in September.

Brian Barwick commented: “The National League restart depends upon crowds being allowed back in stadiums as live attendance is our clubs’ largest source of income.

"The Government urgently needs to set out a credible pathway for the safe return of supporters, and to ensure our football clubs can continue to function, and to perform their significant role in the sporting life of the country.

"We are proud to be a national competition with strong local connections.”
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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by quakerste » Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm

Only three weeks to go before our first home game. Are the club going to have any test events as I'm sure these have to have taken place before the season starts.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by bigdavethemaddog » Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:58 pm

quakerste wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm
Only three weeks to go before our first home game. Are the club going to have any test events as I'm sure these have to have taken place before the season starts.
thought i read they were planning a home friendly as a test event on 26th September

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by quaker4life » Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:09 pm

quakerste wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm
Only three weeks to go before our first home game. Are the club going to have any test events as I'm sure these have to have taken place before the season starts.
They won't be necessary if what has been suggested in the statement above comes to pass.
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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by lo36789 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:27 am

quakerste wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm
Only three weeks to go before our first home game. Are the club going to have any test events as I'm sure these have to have taken place before the season starts.
Are you following the news at the mo?

The EFL started a couple of weeks ago and only now have certain clubs been given permission to conduct test events with up to 1,000 spectators (regardless of stadia size).

Based on the most recent statement the NL don't yet have this permission, and the NL are initially trying to get parity with the EFL

I can't see the NL being able to break the 1,000 ceiling before the EFL are allowed to. It would be strange to allow clubs with fewer resources more capacity allowance.

The decision to allow us to move to the arena on safety grounds is distinct from the government allowing the return in numbers of spectators to elite football. I know the club has to publicly ask the question but this was always a risk (pretty sure it was specifically called out here in last couple of weeks)

The club have to react to what they can legally do.

Unfortunately with cases spiking across the country I am just not sure I am seeing now as a time when measures are going to be relaxed. If anything it feels more like more measures are due to be reimposed.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by lo36789 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:31 am

The thing I am wondering. The National League were adament that the league would not restart without spectators.

So unless something changes in the next 3 weeks we will not be starting our season when scheduled (we will have to play our FA Comp games though as that is distinct from the league season).

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by H1987 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:41 am

This 1,000 figure is meant to be temporary though isn’t i?

It’s a blanket 1,000 across the football league. I’m confused why the board feel like we should be treated differently right now. They’re talking about letting in 1,000 at places like Boro, Norwich, Sunderland, Derby etc (just the biggest football league grounds I could name off the top of my head...)... I don’t see why our board think we should be allowing more in than those places.

Unless their argument is that the blanket 1,000 changes how we would have used Blackwell - I.e. if we knew we were going to be allowed 1,000 in there we would have just carried on there. Personally, even in such circumstances, from a public health view I can see benefits to spreading people out rather than cramming them in the tinshed, even if I want us out of the arena as soon as practicable.

Nonetheless, I can’t see why the board think we should be allowed more in this time period. Frankly, I’m surprised, given the rise in cases, that this is happening.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by dfc4me » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:53 am

I think the NL are just desperate to start the season on Oct 3rd but the 1000 limit is going to upset a lot more NL clubs than just us. The question is how long is “ temporary “. If it’s only for a couple of matches we can probably cope, especially if we can bring in some money from on line streaming, any longer and we will struggle. The annoying thing is that being among 2000 social distanced people in the Arena will be far safer than being in a pub.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by lo36789 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:16 am

dfc4me wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:53 am
The annoying thing is that being among 2000 social distanced people in the Arena will be far safer than being in a pub.
Agreed but I also imagine that Sunderland feel the Stadium of Light can safely accommodate more than 1,000 also.

I feel like we are probably down the pecking order in all of this.

We are in a tricky position now - we have requested the Arena on safety grounds.

If the 1,000 is a blanket figure then can we revert and say we have realised that Blackwell is just as safe (perhaps we can given the numbers that are being talked about). It still doesn't help though as our safe capacity as calculated is well below that 1,000, I am not sure from a HSE perspective you could just choose to take a generic higher figure once you have properly calculated a figure.

Barwick's statement does seem to suggest the NL have moved to a "we will restart with a 1,000 spectator ceiling", I guess it isn't a fundamental shift from "we won't start without spectators" but it equally isn't very helpful.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by H1987 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:39 am

lo36789 wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:16 am
dfc4me wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:53 am
The annoying thing is that being among 2000 social distanced people in the Arena will be far safer than being in a pub.
Agreed but I also imagine that Sunderland feel the Stadium of Light can safely accommodate more than 1,000 also.

I feel like we are probably down the pecking order in all of this.

We are in a tricky position now - we have requested the Arena on safety grounds.

If the 1,000 is a blanket figure then can we revert and say we have realised that Blackwell is just as safe (perhaps we can given the numbers that are being talked about). It still doesn't help though as our safe capacity as calculated is well below that 1,000, I am not sure from a HSE perspective you could just choose to take a generic higher figure once you have properly calculated a figure.

Barwick's statement does seem to suggest the NL have moved to a "we will restart with a 1,000 spectator ceiling", I guess it isn't a fundamental shift from "we won't start without spectators" but it equally isn't very helpful.
Exactly this.

If it is the boards position that the National League should have been clear as we would never have signed this agreement at the Arena, then I understand the complaint... but I can't understand the notion that we should be a special case and more should be let in when even more cavernous Championship stadia are only being allowed the same figure inside. Why should the FA make a special case for us when Sunderland, Boro et al can only have 1,000 too? It doesn't make sense.

I think we can have issue with the National League and the authorities for unclear messaging which may have led to a poor business decision, but we can't exactly have a problem with only being allowed 1,000 in the ground when far larger grounds are the same.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by m62exile » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:52 am

Crossed wires here all over. Until yesterday’s clumsy NL statement it was clear that the governments position was still that there’d be selected trial events with fans up to a thousand, in the lead up to starting “elite” sport from October 1st under Covid restricted capacities defined on a stadium by stadium basis.

Officially this still seems to be the case with DCMS allegedly going to decide in the next couple of days.

The NL statement yesterday was extremely confusing, but so far I’m pretty sure nothing has changed and we’re still working towards the guidance officially communicated by DCMS.

Granted that is subject to confirmation and potential change but so far as I can gather that’s still where we are. Looking at DFC’s statement yesterday, that’s certainly where the board thought we are/ were.


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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by EDJOHNS » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:24 am

I can't see any point whatever in worrying about the arena contract.
It was made pretty clear the 2 years was so we do not have to re-apply every few weeks and also we were told the contract is for us to play there, "for as long as needed during that period". Thus, if we don't use it at all there is no contract to worry about.
It all seemed pretty clear and simple to me the way it was laid out

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by bigdavethemaddog » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:28 am

at the end of the day 1000 is better than nothing. it will still be bringing revenue in that playing behind closed doors wouldnt

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by onewayup » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:28 pm

Quite right bigdavethemaddog i am a season ticket holder and will be paying the entrance fee into the pot either for 50/50 or bucket ,i am fortunate i can do that,every £ counts at this time, we are fan owned so fans have to make up for losses however they occur.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by spen666 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:39 pm

A bit of a speculative story on the https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footb ... EMBER.html

Has worrying implications for all Elite clubs. If its going to be another month at least without fans, does that mean no NL games until then or games behind closed doors. Either way, if this comes to pass it makes it very hard on all clubs for cashflow.

That is without the current local lockdown and its effects on NE clubs.

Worrying times for all clubs.

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by Vodka_Vic » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:56 pm

No spectators allowed at NE grounds during the local lockdown

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by spen666 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:05 pm

Vodka_Vic wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:56 pm
No spectators allowed at NE grounds during the local lockdown
Thats the Northern League and NPL clubs struggling then or games postponed then.

Its going to make it difficult for every club in NE to survive

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Re: impact on ground capacity

Post by Darlo_Pete » Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:06 pm

Vodka_Vic wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:56 pm
No spectators allowed at NE grounds during the local lockdown
It's a good job that we aren't involved in the local lockdown.

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