FA rules on abandonment

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jjljks
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by jjljks » Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:35 am

Boston can have the game. Am more concerned that Hunt makes a full recovery.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by PierremontQuaker03 » Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:25 am

I've watched the incident again - and Hunt was actually fouled, so the ref got it wrong.
The Boston player went for the ball and slipped (I don't think the foul was deliberate) and he ended up slide tackling Hunt who because of this headed the ball backwards which went to a Boston player and from there they had men over so they scored (although without the deflection it wouldn't have gone in). If there was VAR there was no way that goal would have stood.
This capped a great night for the Ref, who was terrible and didn't get a grip of Boston's constant cynical fouling. You could argue that the Boston bench had a part to play intimidating the Ref with their antics from the side lines.
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by lo36789 » Thu Nov 12, 2020 10:49 am

PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:25 am
I've watched the incident again - and Hunt was actually fouled, so the ref got it wrong.
The Boston player went for the ball and slipped (I don't think the foul was deliberate) and he ended up slide tackling Hunt who because of this headed the ball backwards which went to a Boston player and from there they had men over so they scored (although without the deflection it wouldn't have gone in). If there was VAR there was no way that goal would have stood.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Football has officially gone. We might as well start officially terming it no contact as of now.

The player slipped to the floor after being grappled by our right back. Hunt headed the ball unimpeded and Hunt stepped on top of him afterwards.

Never in football has that been a foul. Ever.

What VAR would decide is anyone's guess. It may have glanced the fingernail of an attacker at some point in the build up which would rule the goal out in those terms.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by biccynana » Thu Nov 12, 2020 11:28 am

PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:25 am
I've watched the incident again - and Hunt was actually fouled, so the ref got it wrong.
The Boston player went for the ball and slipped (I don't think the foul was deliberate) and he ended up slide tackling Hunt who because of this headed the ball backwards
You're kidding right? Go to https://youtu.be/PfXzoF7W1P8?t=485 and pause it. The Boston player is already almost on his back on the floor and Hunt is already in the air with distance between them. How can that be a foul? :? And Hunt heads the ball forwards not backwards.

Apart from that, excellent analysis :roll:

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Mister e » Thu Nov 12, 2020 1:31 pm

That referee I believe was Adam Williamson he is a jinx to our club I'm certain he refereed our game at home to Gateshead last season when Luke trotman got his season ending injury. he made some very strange decisions that night too.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Old Git » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:27 pm

Mister e wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 1:31 pm
That referee I believe was Adam Williamson he is a jinx to our club I'm certain he refereed our game at home to Gateshead last season when Luke trotman got his season ending injury. he made some very strange decisions that night too.
Also the game that Jamie Holmes sustained his cruciate knee ligament injury.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by onewayup » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:33 pm

That ref is a bogeyman for Darlington , trotman serious injury then Holmes ,

Ref Adam Williamson needs to stay away we have nothing be bad luck every time he officiates,
Shows how poor the standards have dropped for referees in national league.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by biccynana » Thu Nov 12, 2020 4:16 pm

onewayup wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:33 pm
Ref Adam Williamson needs to stay away we have nothing be bad luck every time he officiates,
Shows how poor the standards have dropped for referees in national league.
Am struggling to see the logic there.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by don'tbuythesun » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:11 pm

Me too!

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by AndyPark » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:32 pm

onewayup wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:33 pm
That ref is a bogeyman for Darlington , trotman serious injury then Holmes ,

Ref Adam Williamson needs to stay away we have nothing be bad luck every time he officiates,
Shows how poor the standards have dropped for referees in national league.
So... What you’re saying is that these injuries are at fault of the match day referee? :wtf: :shock:
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by biccynana » Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:27 pm

don'tbuythesun wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:11 pm
Me too!
Maybe it's National Non-Sequitur Day and I missed the memo.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by lo36789 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:06 am

So listening to Danny O'Connor interview he openly admitted he didn't even run on at full pace because he didn't think anything of it. Yet people above have suggest negligence on the part of the referee for not stopping for a serious injury.

Danny has gone as far to suggest he was wondering at the time if it was simply some gamesmanship on the part of Hunt and McMahon.

Others have said he was motionless. It is seen on the footage they are moving and confirmed by Danny that he was conscious and speaking when he got to him.

It sounds awful and the different concerns that there were potential signs of but had conflicting signs equally. Incredible job by the medical staff of both clubs, but there can be no blame or malpractice apportioned at the match official do it as seems to have been attempted above.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Spyman » Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:54 am

loan_star wrote:
Makka Pakka wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 2:24 pm
loan_star wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 12:58 pm
Whilst I'm mot arsed if its played again or not, had the ref done his job properly then they wouldnt have scored the second goal so there would have only been the 1 goal in it with stoppage time still to play.
You think in the 4-5 seconds between the players going down (which wasn't immediate) and the goal going in it was obvious a serious injury had happened?
I don't think the referee has any case to answer here.
The ref had a quick glance and, even though Hunt was holding his head, didnt have a second look until the end of the passage of play.
He had ample chance to have a second look before the goal was scored. It takes a fraction of a second to have a second glance and if he had he would have seen it was a head injury. Poor refereeing.
If there's a clear goalscoring opportunity I would expect the referee to be focussing on that - what if there had been a foul, handball or other incident? If he missed that because he was taking a second glance at a player he'd already seen was on the floor but moving, you'd want his head on a block as well.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by loan_star » Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:55 pm

Spyman wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:54 am
If there's a clear goalscoring opportunity I would expect the referee to be focussing on that - what if there had been a foul, handball or other incident? If he missed that because he was taking a second glance at a player he'd already seen was on the floor but moving, you'd want his head on a block as well.

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Heres me thinking he had assistants :o

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by lo36789 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:27 pm

loan_star wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:55 pm
Spyman wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:54 am
If there's a clear goalscoring opportunity I would expect the referee to be focussing on that - what if there had been a foul, handball or other incident? If he missed that because he was taking a second glance at a player he'd already seen was on the floor but moving, you'd want his head on a block as well.

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Heres me thinking he had assistants :o
Who are predominantly in an attacking situation looking across from the touchline at the last defender for offside judgements which tend to be pretty crucial from goalscoring situations.

The semi-active assistant is 50metres away.

The medically qualified members of our bench didn't identify there was an injury requiring urgent attention even after the game was stopped and you expect a match official to provide a better assessment whilst being tasked with monitoring play as it continues.

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loan_star
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by loan_star » Fri Nov 13, 2020 6:58 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:27 pm
loan_star wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:55 pm
Spyman wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:54 am
If there's a clear goalscoring opportunity I would expect the referee to be focussing on that - what if there had been a foul, handball or other incident? If he missed that because he was taking a second glance at a player he'd already seen was on the floor but moving, you'd want his head on a block as well.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
Heres me thinking he had assistants :o
Who are predominantly in an attacking situation looking across from the touchline at the last defender for offside judgements which tend to be pretty crucial from goalscoring situations.

The semi-active assistant is 50metres away.

The medically qualified members of our bench didn't identify there was an injury requiring urgent attention even after the game was stopped and you expect a match official to provide a better assessment whilst being tasked with monitoring play as it continues.
Now heres me thinking assistants can also flag for fouls and handballs that the referee doesn't see, so the referee can take more notice of the injury situation.......

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by lo36789 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:26 pm

loan_star wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 6:58 pm
Now heres me thinking assistants can also flag for fouls and handballs that the referee doesn't see, so the referee can take more notice of the injury situation.......
Not with any credibility when the play is on left hand side of penalty area and AR is on right touchline watching for offside judgements if there is a shot which rebounds or forward pass, also looking through maybe 8 / 9 bodies if trying to spot a penal offence.

Inactive has no credibility in opposite penalty area c. 60 yards away. No comms kits either to provide input. If more than 20yards away from an incident your judgement is flawed. Would you accept a key penalty decision from someone who is no closer than the dugouts?

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by loan_star » Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:35 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:26 pm
loan_star wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 6:58 pm
Now heres me thinking assistants can also flag for fouls and handballs that the referee doesn't see, so the referee can take more notice of the injury situation.......
Not with any credibility when the play is on left hand side of penalty area and AR is on right touchline watching for offside judgements if there is a shot which rebounds or forward pass, also looking through maybe 8 / 9 bodies if trying to spot a penal offence.

Inactive has no credibility in opposite penalty area c. 60 yards away. No comms kits either to provide input. If more than 20yards away from an incident your judgement is flawed. Would you accept a key penalty decision from someone who is no closer than the dugouts?
Considering the situation on the pitch, yes I would. Why is it that some refs will blow straight away when theres an issue no matter where the play is but you seem intent on defending the ref from the other night who barely gave the incident a glance?

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by lo36789 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:57 am

Because simply put based on the information available he did the right thing. No official with the ball in such an advanced position should be blowing. Especially not with the way it occurred as confirmed there wasn't actually any point Hunt's head hit another player.

Watch tomorrows game and imagine if the referee stopped it every time a player stays on the floor for more than 3 seconds.

You still seem convinced the referee should have some how recognised the severity of the injury even though our own medical staff said they didn't see anything of concern initially - in fact he says that as he got to Hunt he was still talking and swearing so even at that point what was to come was unexpected.

The deterioration happen minutes after the collision not seconds so what exactly was the march official meant to spot which warranted stopping the game within 7 seconds?

You are exhibiting the same complex as a lot of fans in that default position is referee is incorrect if decision doesnt go in favour of your team. Had that been down the other opposite and the game been stopped and after some treatment by the physio the players got up you would be making an argument that if was incorrect.

Remember our own physio thought it was gamesmanship until he spoke to Hunt.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by don'tbuythesun » Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:22 am

Accepting that the injury was far more serious than anyone first thought I'm sure many would have been unhappy if the ref had blown up and we were the attacking team. It's not easy to referee and he doesn't have eyes in the back of his head. Think some of the comments on here are pretty unfair. Hindsight, the perfect science. Thankfully all appears well with Nicky and I wish him a speedy recovery.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Old Git » Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:35 am

Agreed it was a tough call for the referee to stop play given the seemingly innocuous way the injury occurred. I think the majority of us are just grateful that things turned out ok in the end although it looks like Nicky Hunt will miss a few games it could have been much worse.
As for what happens to the result let it stand and move on.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by loan_star » Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:00 am

lo36789 wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:57 am

You are exhibiting the same complex as a lot of fans in that default position is referee is incorrect if decision doesnt go in favour of your team. Had that been down the other opposite and the game been stopped and after some treatment by the physio the players got up you would be making an argument that if was incorrect.
Rubbish, I am basing on the fact that other referees blow almost immediately when a situation like that happens. Yes its annoying when you are the attacking team but the players safety comes first.

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Ghost_Of_1883 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:21 pm

JasonDeVos wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:28 am
Did we not get a win against warrington after it was abandoned at half time??
We did, it was abandoned after only about 15 minutes when we were already 2-0 up and running absolutely riot. The 2-0 result was given but it could have ended up 6 the way we were playing that day, no one will ever know.

The circumstances were different though, if I recall correctly the ref got injured, and Warrington simply refused to play on using that as a convenient excuse to avoid a hammering, and the league knew it.
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Ghost_Of_1883 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:24 pm

PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:25 am
I've watched the incident again - and Hunt was actually fouled, so the ref got it wrong.
The Boston player went for the ball and slipped (I don't think the foul was deliberate) and he ended up slide tackling Hunt who because of this headed the ball backwards which went to a Boston player and from there they had men over so they scored (although without the deflection it wouldn't have gone in). If there was VAR there was no way that goal would have stood.
This capped a great night for the Ref, who was terrible and didn't get a grip of Boston's constant cynical fouling. You could argue that the Boston bench had a part to play intimidating the Ref with their antics from the side lines.
Disagree completely. The ref had a good game overall, and his decision making was fair. I've seen many, many worse refs.

Yes Boston were niggly foulers but that's part and parcel of the game. It's teams like that who grind out results because not only can they play themselves, but they can stop the opposition playing when they need to. Frustrating to watch if you're on the end of it though.
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Ghost_Of_1883 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:32 pm

LoidLucan wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 1:40 pm
I think with two players prone after a collision like that it was a bit surprising the game wasn't halted especially in this increasingly cautious health and safety world. Surely even Boston couldn't have complained if the game had been stopped in the circumstances.

They were extremely unfortunate and unusual circumstances last night with no blame attached to either side. The game should be replayed, never mind the score or who may or may not have won had it been completed. Games aren't normally decided on the grounds of probability.
The game should be replayed because the Boston keeper is a massive wankspasm who was chirpsing on after the match about it maybe having to be replayed, and about the state of our ground - tweeting all this from his phone whilst driving.
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Ghost_Of_1883 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:35 pm

leedscol wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:22 pm
Look if it was the other way round and we had been 2-0 up and a Boston player injured, would you still expect the game to be replayed? I think not.
I'd be burning with rage Ray, burning with rage - in the best Hodgie stylee, if the shoe was on the other foot.

However, it could be argued that play should have been stopped before the 2nd goal, leaving us at 1-0 down with 4 minutes plus injury time left. Last minute equalisers can and do happen even when they seem unlikely.
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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by LoidLucan » Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:39 pm

Ghost_Of_1883 wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:32 pm
LoidLucan wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 1:40 pm
I think with two players prone after a collision like that it was a bit surprising the game wasn't halted especially in this increasingly cautious health and safety world. Surely even Boston couldn't have complained if the game had been stopped in the circumstances.

They were extremely unfortunate and unusual circumstances last night with no blame attached to either side. The game should be replayed, never mind the score or who may or may not have won had it been completed. Games aren't normally decided on the grounds of probability.
The game should be replayed because the Boston keeper is a massive wankspasm who was chirpsing on after the match about it maybe having to be replayed, and about the state of our ground - tweeting all this from his phone whilst driving.

Yup and I think's it's covered under National League Rule 24, sub-section 1, regarding the conduct of Tosspots :D

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Darlo2807 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:13 pm

In all honesty I think the game should be replayed. Open to interpretation but I believe the game should’ve been stopped before their second goal went in, and if we’re going to chase promotion we need to stop being the nice guys. Do you really think the Salford of years gone by would’ve sacrificed a game like that?

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by Darlo2807 » Sat Nov 14, 2020 4:10 pm

Darlo2807 wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:13 pm
if we’re going to chase promotion
Don’t think we have to worry about that

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Re: FA rules on abandonment

Post by AndyPark » Sat Nov 14, 2020 4:27 pm

Darlo2807 wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 4:10 pm
Darlo2807 wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:13 pm
if we’re going to chase promotion
Don’t think we have to worry about that
Been awful against Boston and shite again here vs Telford.
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