DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

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loan_star
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by loan_star » Sat Feb 13, 2021 6:13 pm

I think we are playing safe by playing when we are meant to, or at least being available to play, until the result of the ballot is published.
Technically the league can take action against clubs refusing to play until this is resolved, whether that be fines or even point reductions applied next season. Whether any action the league takes is morally correct or not is another can of worms.

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Alfie » Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:21 pm

A number of teams have announced that they have/will furlough their contracted players and if necessary fulfil their fixtures using academy, non-contract players and probably anyone who stands outside the ground with his boots.

Someone on twitter has asked if it is legal to furlough an employee and then get someone else to do their job.

Is their a legal expert who can clarify this?

lo36789
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by lo36789 » Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:57 pm

Alfie wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:21 pm
A number of teams have announced that they have/will furlough their contracted players and if necessary fulfil their fixtures using academy, non-contract players and probably anyone who stands outside the ground with his boots.

Someone on twitter has asked if it is legal to furlough an employee and then get someone else to do their job.

Is their a legal expert who can clarify this?
Depends how they do it. You obvs can't furlough a whole staff base and bring in new staff who you pay.

However, so long as they are registered players its not getting someone else to do their job they are just as eligible to play as the other players. It is the equivalent of furloughing a part of your staff base whilst keeping the rest on to cover work which needs doing.

Anyone who stands outside of the ground and turns up with a pair of boots would be difficult to justify.

Spen is our resident legal expert...

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:28 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:57 pm
Alfie wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:21 pm
A number of teams have announced that they have/will furlough their contracted players and if necessary fulfil their fixtures using academy, non-contract players and probably anyone who stands outside the ground with his boots.

Someone on twitter has asked if it is legal to furlough an employee and then get someone else to do their job.

Is their a legal expert who can clarify this?
Depends how they do it. You obvs can't furlough a whole staff base and bring in new staff who you pay.

However, so long as they are registered players its not getting someone else to do their job they are just as eligible to play as the other players. It is the equivalent of furloughing a part of your staff base whilst keeping the rest on to cover work which needs doing.

Anyone who stands outside of the ground and turns up with a pair of boots would be difficult to justify.

Spen is our resident legal expert...
He is, isn't he? Such a brilliant legal mind. The same person who said the following:

"The claim would be a strong claim, because the league asked clubs to vote on something, then halfway through voting changed the position.

The claim would be against the NL Management Board.

The claim would almost certainly be bound to succeed on its merits. York could rightly argue that the provision of testing was one of main objections of clubs, and it now being available would affect how clubs voted. The NL should have made the announcement before the voting started.

The remedy would be for the voting to be re run. The voting is a farce when half the clubs vote on one basis of facts, then the facts are changed by the poll organiser

It cannot be a fair poll when the poll organiser changes the facts halfway through voting after clubs have started voting"

Then went completely silent when asked what the cause of action would be for such a claim, where it should be issued, and how/why that would be the remedy.

He's been pontificating about legal stuff he doesn't understand on this thread too, and I'll dig it out if I've got the energy. For now, just trust me that anything he says about law is about as likely to be correct as something typed by a monkey.

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:42 pm

spen666 wrote:
Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:12 pm
"Those letters to Curzon and Dulwich are interesting."

Aren't they just?

"Is seems as if the NL Board have brought the charges & the NL Board have said they will be appointing the panel to decide the matter, if I have read the letters correctly""

You aren't sure whether you've been able to read them correctly?

"If that is correct, then it breaches the rules of Natural Justice that no many is to be prosecution and jury in a case. The FA have in recent years changed their rules so the cases are decided by an independent tribunal, seperate [sic] from the prosecution."

Natural Justice (your capitalisation)? Do elaborate, please. I had no idea that justice was a naturally occurring phenomenon.

"The NL could well be in difficulties if they are prosecuting and deciding the cases"
That's fascinating: what difficulties? How? If you know of a way of issuing a successful legal claim for which the cause of action is a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice", please do tell me - I'm genuinely intrigued.

spen666
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by spen666 » Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:12 am

Richie_darlo wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:42 pm
spen666 wrote:
Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:12 pm
"Those letters to Curzon and Dulwich are interesting."

Aren't they just?

"Is seems as if the NL Board have brought the charges & the NL Board have said they will be appointing the panel to decide the matter, if I have read the letters correctly""

You aren't sure whether you've been able to read them correctly?

"If that is correct, then it breaches the rules of Natural Justice that no many is to be prosecution and jury in a case. The FA have in recent years changed their rules so the cases are decided by an independent tribunal, seperate [sic] from the prosecution."

Natural Justice (your capitalisation)? Do elaborate, please. I had no idea that justice was a naturally occurring phenomenon.

"The NL could well be in difficulties if they are prosecuting and deciding the cases"
That's fascinating: what difficulties? How? If you know of a way of issuing a successful legal claim for which the cause of action is a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice", please do tell me - I'm genuinely intrigued.
Breach of Contract....a radical concept you may not have heard of. Its only been in existence for centuries and is the subject of hundreds if not thousands of reported legal cases

Imagine if you were able to do a Google search for yourself. You may come up with information like this

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication

But I am sure you know better than M'learned friends

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication


Or perhaps the ruling of Lord Denning as Master of the Rolls in the then Court of Appeal in the case of Enderby Town Football Club Ltd v. Football Association Ltd which can be found at [1971] Ch 591

Or the case of Lee v. Showmen’s Guild of Great Britain





Still, don't let settled and clear legal issues stop you.

Darlofan97
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:59 pm

Alfie wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:21 pm
A number of teams have announced that they have/will furlough their contracted players and if necessary fulfil their fixtures using academy, non-contract players and probably anyone who stands outside the ground with his boots.

Someone on twitter has asked if it is legal to furlough an employee and then get someone else to do their job.

Is their a legal expert who can clarify this?
I’m no expert, but yes.

The furlough scheme is in place to protect jobs that would otherwise be lost as a result of the pandemic.

As adequate funding has not been sourced, and the main source of our revenue is not forthcoming (crowds), then it would be reasonable to suggest a natural response would be to start making redundancies and/or mutually terminating player contracts to safeguard the financial future of the business.

The furlough scheme is in place to stop businesses from having to do this en masse, so we would be well within our rights to do this but also keep the business running at minimal cost (non-contracts/loans/youth-team etc).

H1987
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by H1987 » Sun Feb 14, 2021 2:07 pm

Darlofan97 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:59 pm
Alfie wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:21 pm
A number of teams have announced that they have/will furlough their contracted players and if necessary fulfil their fixtures using academy, non-contract players and probably anyone who stands outside the ground with his boots.

Someone on twitter has asked if it is legal to furlough an employee and then get someone else to do their job.

Is their a legal expert who can clarify this?
I’m no expert, but yes.

The furlough scheme is in place to protect jobs that would otherwise be lost as a result of the pandemic.

As adequate funding has not been sourced, and the main source of our revenue is not forthcoming (crowds), then it would be reasonable to suggest a natural response would be to start making redundancies and/or mutually terminating player contracts to safeguard the financial future of the business.

The furlough scheme is in place to stop businesses from having to do this en masse, so we would be well within our rights to do this but also keep the business running at minimal cost (non-contracts/loans/youth-team etc).
I didn’t think the issue with doing this was the legality of it (which I think is justifiable as you’ve said above) but rather the league rules themselves make it an offence to deliberately field a weakened side, and is punishable by (I assume) fines and points dedications.

Whether clubs could argue they are fielding the best available to them because senior players are furloughed is, I suppose, another matter.

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by lo36789 » Sun Feb 14, 2021 2:53 pm

H1987 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 2:07 pm
Whether clubs could argue they are fielding the best available to them because senior players are furloughed is, I suppose, another matter.
This. If players are unavailable for selection you can't select them.

lo36789
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by lo36789 » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:20 pm

There appears to be a quote from Mark Ives which basically suggests the league board dont even know if taking the loans available would be a breach of league roles.

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:42 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:20 pm
There appears to be a quote from Mark Ives which basically suggests the league board dont even know if taking the loans available would be a breach of league roles.
I’ve seen this. Mark Ives sounds like the kind of guy who takes two hours backing his car out of the garage. What do these people do all day?
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:56 pm

spen666 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:12 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:42 pm
spen666 wrote:
Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:12 pm
"Those letters to Curzon and Dulwich are interesting."

Aren't they just?

"Is seems as if the NL Board have brought the charges & the NL Board have said they will be appointing the panel to decide the matter, if I have read the letters correctly""

You aren't sure whether you've been able to read them correctly?

"If that is correct, then it breaches the rules of Natural Justice that no many is to be prosecution and jury in a case. The FA have in recent years changed their rules so the cases are decided by an independent tribunal, seperate [sic] from the prosecution."

Natural Justice (your capitalisation)? Do elaborate, please. I had no idea that justice was a naturally occurring phenomenon.

"The NL could well be in difficulties if they are prosecuting and deciding the cases"
That's fascinating: what difficulties? How? If you know of a way of issuing a successful legal claim for which the cause of action is a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice", please do tell me - I'm genuinely intrigued.
Breach of Contract....a radical concept you may not have heard of. Its only been in existence for centuries and is the subject of hundreds if not thousands of reported legal cases

Imagine if you were able to do a Google search for yourself. You may come up with information like this

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication

But I am sure you know better than M'learned friends

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication


Or perhaps the ruling of Lord Denning as Master of the Rolls in the then Court of Appeal in the case of Enderby Town Football Club Ltd v. Football Association Ltd which can be found at [1971] Ch 591

Or the case of Lee v. Showmen’s Guild of Great Britain





Still, don't let settled and clear legal issues stop you.
This is excellent. I've needed an explanation of the concept of breach of contract for quite some time now, so I'm very grateful to you for providing it. Who knew that it was so famous and long-standing a legal principle?!

It doesn't actually answer the question I asked, though, which was how you could be so sure that a "legal claim" (as you put it) would be successful if its cause of action was 'a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice"'. I don't want to get bogged down in details, but that is an important point and your further educated input on that would definitely be helpful.

In any event, notwithstanding how grateful I am to you for your irrelevant explanation, could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim? I'm sure you'll agree that citing the particulars of breach with sufficient particularity, and knowing the correct forum in which to issue a claim, are both supremely important when pleading a case for breach of contract; and that for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract had occurred without having sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule.

Really looking forward to your further input on these points. As I've said previously, we're incredibly lucky on this forum to have the input of such an amazing legal mind, who - despite being unable to punctuate or spell - doesn't let those deficiencies (which would normally be fatal to a legal career) hold him back from opining with such accuracy and insight on all things legal.

spen666
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by spen666 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:23 am

Richie_darlo wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:56 pm
spen666 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:12 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:42 pm
spen666 wrote:
Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:12 pm
"Those letters to Curzon and Dulwich are interesting."

Aren't they just?

"Is seems as if the NL Board have brought the charges & the NL Board have said they will be appointing the panel to decide the matter, if I have read the letters correctly""

You aren't sure whether you've been able to read them correctly?

"If that is correct, then it breaches the rules of Natural Justice that no many is to be prosecution and jury in a case. The FA have in recent years changed their rules so the cases are decided by an independent tribunal, seperate [sic] from the prosecution."

Natural Justice (your capitalisation)? Do elaborate, please. I had no idea that justice was a naturally occurring phenomenon.

"The NL could well be in difficulties if they are prosecuting and deciding the cases"
That's fascinating: what difficulties? How? If you know of a way of issuing a successful legal claim for which the cause of action is a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice", please do tell me - I'm genuinely intrigued.
Breach of Contract....a radical concept you may not have heard of. Its only been in existence for centuries and is the subject of hundreds if not thousands of reported legal cases

Imagine if you were able to do a Google search for yourself. You may come up with information like this

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication

But I am sure you know better than M'learned friends

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication


Or perhaps the ruling of Lord Denning as Master of the Rolls in the then Court of Appeal in the case of Enderby Town Football Club Ltd v. Football Association Ltd which can be found at [1971] Ch 591

Or the case of Lee v. Showmen’s Guild of Great Britain





Still, don't let settled and clear legal issues stop you.
This is excellent. I've needed an explanation of the concept of breach of contract for quite some time now, so I'm very grateful to you for providing it. Who knew that it was so famous and long-standing a legal principle?!

It doesn't actually answer the question I asked, though, which was how you could be so sure that a "legal claim" (as you put it) would be successful if its cause of action was 'a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice"'. I don't want to get bogged down in details, but that is an important point and your further educated input on that would definitely be helpful.

In any event, notwithstanding how grateful I am to you for your irrelevant explanation, could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim? I'm sure you'll agree that citing the particulars of breach with sufficient particularity, and knowing the correct forum in which to issue a claim, are both supremely important when pleading a case for breach of contract; and that for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract had occurred without having sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule.

Really looking forward to your further input on these points. As I've said previously, we're incredibly lucky on this forum to have the input of such an amazing legal mind, who - despite being unable to punctuate or spell - doesn't let those deficiencies (which would normally be fatal to a legal career) hold him back from opining with such accuracy and insight on all things legal.
How can I be sure a claim would succeed?

The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case.

(The NL have already back pedalled on this and announced charges will be heard by an independent tribunal)

I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding. It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial.

Richie_darlo
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:34 am

spen666 wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:23 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:56 pm
spen666 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:12 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:42 pm
spen666 wrote:
Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:12 pm
"Those letters to Curzon and Dulwich are interesting."

Aren't they just?

"Is seems as if the NL Board have brought the charges & the NL Board have said they will be appointing the panel to decide the matter, if I have read the letters correctly""

You aren't sure whether you've been able to read them correctly?

"If that is correct, then it breaches the rules of Natural Justice that no many is to be prosecution and jury in a case. The FA have in recent years changed their rules so the cases are decided by an independent tribunal, seperate [sic] from the prosecution."

Natural Justice (your capitalisation)? Do elaborate, please. I had no idea that justice was a naturally occurring phenomenon.

"The NL could well be in difficulties if they are prosecuting and deciding the cases"
That's fascinating: what difficulties? How? If you know of a way of issuing a successful legal claim for which the cause of action is a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice", please do tell me - I'm genuinely intrigued.
Breach of Contract....a radical concept you may not have heard of. Its only been in existence for centuries and is the subject of hundreds if not thousands of reported legal cases

Imagine if you were able to do a Google search for yourself. You may come up with information like this

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication

But I am sure you know better than M'learned friends

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication


Or perhaps the ruling of Lord Denning as Master of the Rolls in the then Court of Appeal in the case of Enderby Town Football Club Ltd v. Football Association Ltd which can be found at [1971] Ch 591

Or the case of Lee v. Showmen’s Guild of Great Britain





Still, don't let settled and clear legal issues stop you.
This is excellent. I've needed an explanation of the concept of breach of contract for quite some time now, so I'm very grateful to you for providing it. Who knew that it was so famous and long-standing a legal principle?!

It doesn't actually answer the question I asked, though, which was how you could be so sure that a "legal claim" (as you put it) would be successful if its cause of action was 'a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice"'. I don't want to get bogged down in details, but that is an important point and your further educated input on that would definitely be helpful.

In any event, notwithstanding how grateful I am to you for your irrelevant explanation, could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim? I'm sure you'll agree that citing the particulars of breach with sufficient particularity, and knowing the correct forum in which to issue a claim, are both supremely important when pleading a case for breach of contract; and that for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract had occurred without having sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule.

Really looking forward to your further input on these points. As I've said previously, we're incredibly lucky on this forum to have the input of such an amazing legal mind, who - despite being unable to punctuate or spell - doesn't let those deficiencies (which would normally be fatal to a legal career) hold him back from opining with such accuracy and insight on all things legal.
How can I be sure a claim would succeed?

The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case.

(The NL have already back pedalled on this and announced charges will be heard by an independent tribunal)

I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding. It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial.
"Could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim...because for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract would be certain to succeed without having had sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule?"

I'll take your lack of response to this as a no. Looking forward to your further input, though, because this is the crux of the issue and - given you're such a talented lawyer - it's important that we get to the bottom of this.

"The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case [sic]."

I'm sorry? What exactly are you trying to say here? For such a high-powered legal mind, you seem to have a great deal of difficulty expressing yourself. Anybody might think you aren't actually all that talented in legal matters, but of course we know that's not true, because you've told us so. I'm trying, and utterly failing, to imagine how to plead this case that you describe as a certain win; but no doubt that's because your legal talents are so much more developed than those of anybody else on this forum.

"I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding."

Where to begin with this? It's all but impossible to do so, since you still - after having been asked three times - haven't said exactly what the cause of action would be for this "legal claim", nor in which forum it should be issued. Are you actually suggesting that you can be "sure" that an unspecified claim (which you've suggested might be for breach of contract, without even having identified the contract which has been breached), with an unspecified cause of action, and an unspecified plea for relief, would succeed? Do you even understand how precedent works? This is really pretty basic stuff, and to be honest I'm beginning to wonder whether you're quite as talented in legal matters as you've held yourself out to be; please don't let me down, here.

"It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial."

Oh dear. I'm sure you know that randomly capitalising words doesn't give them any greater force in a legal context (perhaps you are somehow suggesting that "Natural Justice" is a defined term?). It's really disappointing to see such a loose use of language from a peerless legal talent like you. I'm also troubled by the conflation of criminal and civil law by the "Spennymoor Sumption".

Really looking forward as always to your clarification in relation to the above - these are important legal issues, and it's crucial that we have the input of the best legal minds available. Far be it from me to criticise somebody with your weight of legal intellect, but it would probably help your audience if in future you could formulate your legal wisdom in comprehensible sentences.

spen666
Posts: 1985
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:12 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by spen666 » Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:31 am

Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:34 am
spen666 wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:23 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:56 pm
spen666 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:12 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:42 pm


That's fascinating: what difficulties? How? If you know of a way of issuing a successful legal claim for which the cause of action is a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice", please do tell me - I'm genuinely intrigued.
Breach of Contract....a radical concept you may not have heard of. Its only been in existence for centuries and is the subject of hundreds if not thousands of reported legal cases

Imagine if you were able to do a Google search for yourself. You may come up with information like this

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication

But I am sure you know better than M'learned friends

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication


Or perhaps the ruling of Lord Denning as Master of the Rolls in the then Court of Appeal in the case of Enderby Town Football Club Ltd v. Football Association Ltd which can be found at [1971] Ch 591

Or the case of Lee v. Showmen’s Guild of Great Britain





Still, don't let settled and clear legal issues stop you.
This is excellent. I've needed an explanation of the concept of breach of contract for quite some time now, so I'm very grateful to you for providing it. Who knew that it was so famous and long-standing a legal principle?!

It doesn't actually answer the question I asked, though, which was how you could be so sure that a "legal claim" (as you put it) would be successful if its cause of action was 'a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice"'. I don't want to get bogged down in details, but that is an important point and your further educated input on that would definitely be helpful.

In any event, notwithstanding how grateful I am to you for your irrelevant explanation, could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim? I'm sure you'll agree that citing the particulars of breach with sufficient particularity, and knowing the correct forum in which to issue a claim, are both supremely important when pleading a case for breach of contract; and that for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract had occurred without having sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule.

Really looking forward to your further input on these points. As I've said previously, we're incredibly lucky on this forum to have the input of such an amazing legal mind, who - despite being unable to punctuate or spell - doesn't let those deficiencies (which would normally be fatal to a legal career) hold him back from opining with such accuracy and insight on all things legal.
How can I be sure a claim would succeed?

The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case.

(The NL have already back pedalled on this and announced charges will be heard by an independent tribunal)

I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding. It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial.
"Could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim...because for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract would be certain to succeed without having had sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule?"

I'll take your lack of response to this as a no. Looking forward to your further input, though, because this is the crux of the issue and - given you're such a talented lawyer - it's important that we get to the bottom of this.

"The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case [sic]."

I'm sorry? What exactly are you trying to say here? For such a high-powered legal mind, you seem to have a great deal of difficulty expressing yourself. Anybody might think you aren't actually all that talented in legal matters, but of course we know that's not true, because you've told us so. I'm trying, and utterly failing, to imagine how to plead this case that you describe as a certain win; but no doubt that's because your legal talents are so much more developed than those of anybody else on this forum.

"I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding."

Where to begin with this? It's all but impossible to do so, since you still - after having been asked three times - haven't said exactly what the cause of action would be for this "legal claim", nor in which forum it should be issued. Are you actually suggesting that you can be "sure" that an unspecified claim (which you've suggested might be for breach of contract, without even having identified the contract which has been breached), with an unspecified cause of action, and an unspecified plea for relief, would succeed? Do you even understand how precedent works? This is really pretty basic stuff, and to be honest I'm beginning to wonder whether you're quite as talented in legal matters as you've held yourself out to be; please don't let me down, here.

"It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial."

Oh dear. I'm sure you know that randomly capitalising words doesn't give them any greater force in a legal context (perhaps you are somehow suggesting that "Natural Justice" is a defined term?). It's really disappointing to see such a loose use of language from a peerless legal talent like you. I'm also troubled by the conflation of criminal and civil law by the "Spennymoor Sumption".

Really looking forward as always to your clarification in relation to the above - these are important legal issues, and it's crucial that we have the input of the best legal minds available. Far be it from me to criticise somebody with your weight of legal intellect, but it would probably help your audience if in future you could formulate your legal wisdom in comprehensible sentences.


Yawn yawn

Yes Ritchie you are clearly the king of legal knowledge and all the judicial aithihsve got it wrong and their is nothing wrong with the same body being judge and prosecution in a case.

The courts through history have got it wrong

There is no such thing as a breach of Natural Justice

You may think you are being clever, but all your points have been answered if you bothered to read what is posted, including the precedent cases referred to. Try reading the Enderby Town case for example or the Showmanship Guild case, they answer your questions.

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Quaker85
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Quaker85 » Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:14 am

I’m no legal expert but what I do know is that the legal profession is very adept at constructing sentences and the use of language, especially in the spelling department. Spen is not.


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spen666
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by spen666 » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:28 am

Quaker85 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:14 am
I’m no legal expert but what I do know is that the legal profession is very adept at constructing sentences and the use of language, especially in the spelling department. Spen is not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You want me to write message board posts in legalease? Happy to do so, but most people will not understand it and complain about the use of such language

For example, I could have referred to the remedies of Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available to a claimant. Does that make sense to the average reader of this board?

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by banktopp » Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:41 am

spen666 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:28 am
Quaker85 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:14 am
I’m no legal expert but what I do know is that the legal profession is very adept at constructing sentences and the use of language, especially in the spelling department. Spen is not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You want me to write message board posts in legalease? Happy to do so, but most people will not understand it and complain about the use of such language

For example, I could have referred to the remedies of Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available to a claimant. Does that make sense to the average reader of this board?
About as much sense as you do on this board.

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Quaker85
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Quaker85 » Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:43 am

spen666 wrote:
Quaker85 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:14 am
I’m no legal expert but what I do know is that the legal profession is very adept at constructing sentences and the use of language, especially in the spelling department. Spen is not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You want me to write message board posts in legalease? Happy to do so, but most people will not understand it and complain about the use of such language

For example, I could have referred to the remedies of Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available to a claimant. Does that make sense to the average reader of this board?
No I just wanted you to use basic grammar rules eg their, there, they’re etc


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Richie_darlo
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:46 am

spen666 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:28 am
Quaker85 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:14 am
I’m no legal expert but what I do know is that the legal profession is very adept at constructing sentences and the use of language, especially in the spelling department. Spen is not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You want me to write message board posts in legalease? Happy to do so, but most people will not understand it and complain about the use of such language

For example, I could have referred to the remedies of Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available to a claimant. Does that make sense to the average reader of this board?
To think I'd been incorrectly spelling it "legalese" all this time!

"Yes Ritchie you are clearly the king of legal knowledge and all the judicial aithihsve got it wrong and their is nothing wrong"

To think I've been misspelling my own name and not understanding the difference between their, there and they're all this time!

To think, more generally, that I'd wrongly believed that legal writing involved setting out complex matters as clearly, comprehensibly, and precisely as possible!

I stand corrected on all the above. The Spennymoor Sumption has spoken.

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:09 pm

spen666 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:31 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:34 am
spen666 wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:23 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:56 pm
spen666 wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:12 am


Breach of Contract....a radical concept you may not have heard of. Its only been in existence for centuries and is the subject of hundreds if not thousands of reported legal cases

Imagine if you were able to do a Google search for yourself. You may come up with information like this

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication

But I am sure you know better than M'learned friends

https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guid ... judication


Or perhaps the ruling of Lord Denning as Master of the Rolls in the then Court of Appeal in the case of Enderby Town Football Club Ltd v. Football Association Ltd which can be found at [1971] Ch 591

Or the case of Lee v. Showmen’s Guild of Great Britain





Still, don't let settled and clear legal issues stop you.
This is excellent. I've needed an explanation of the concept of breach of contract for quite some time now, so I'm very grateful to you for providing it. Who knew that it was so famous and long-standing a legal principle?!

It doesn't actually answer the question I asked, though, which was how you could be so sure that a "legal claim" (as you put it) would be successful if its cause of action was 'a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice"'. I don't want to get bogged down in details, but that is an important point and your further educated input on that would definitely be helpful.

In any event, notwithstanding how grateful I am to you for your irrelevant explanation, could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim? I'm sure you'll agree that citing the particulars of breach with sufficient particularity, and knowing the correct forum in which to issue a claim, are both supremely important when pleading a case for breach of contract; and that for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract had occurred without having sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule.

Really looking forward to your further input on these points. As I've said previously, we're incredibly lucky on this forum to have the input of such an amazing legal mind, who - despite being unable to punctuate or spell - doesn't let those deficiencies (which would normally be fatal to a legal career) hold him back from opining with such accuracy and insight on all things legal.
How can I be sure a claim would succeed?

The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case.

(The NL have already back pedalled on this and announced charges will be heard by an independent tribunal)

I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding. It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial.
"Could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim...because for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract would be certain to succeed without having had sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule?"

I'll take your lack of response to this as a no. Looking forward to your further input, though, because this is the crux of the issue and - given you're such a talented lawyer - it's important that we get to the bottom of this.

"The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case [sic]."

I'm sorry? What exactly are you trying to say here? For such a high-powered legal mind, you seem to have a great deal of difficulty expressing yourself. Anybody might think you aren't actually all that talented in legal matters, but of course we know that's not true, because you've told us so. I'm trying, and utterly failing, to imagine how to plead this case that you describe as a certain win; but no doubt that's because your legal talents are so much more developed than those of anybody else on this forum.

"I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding."

Where to begin with this? It's all but impossible to do so, since you still - after having been asked three times - haven't said exactly what the cause of action would be for this "legal claim", nor in which forum it should be issued. Are you actually suggesting that you can be "sure" that an unspecified claim (which you've suggested might be for breach of contract, without even having identified the contract which has been breached), with an unspecified cause of action, and an unspecified plea for relief, would succeed? Do you even understand how precedent works? This is really pretty basic stuff, and to be honest I'm beginning to wonder whether you're quite as talented in legal matters as you've held yourself out to be; please don't let me down, here.

"It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial."

Oh dear. I'm sure you know that randomly capitalising words doesn't give them any greater force in a legal context (perhaps you are somehow suggesting that "Natural Justice" is a defined term?). It's really disappointing to see such a loose use of language from a peerless legal talent like you. I'm also troubled by the conflation of criminal and civil law by the "Spennymoor Sumption".

Really looking forward as always to your clarification in relation to the above - these are important legal issues, and it's crucial that we have the input of the best legal minds available. Far be it from me to criticise somebody with your weight of legal intellect, but it would probably help your audience if in future you could formulate your legal wisdom in comprehensible sentences.


Yawn yawn

Yes Ritchie you are clearly the king of legal knowledge and all the judicial aithihsve got it wrong and their is nothing wrong with the same body being judge and prosecution in a case.

The courts through history have got it wrong

There is no such thing as a breach of Natural Justice

You may think you are being clever, but all your points have been answered if you bothered to read what is posted, including the precedent cases referred to. Try reading the Enderby Town case for example or the Showmanship Guild case, they answer your questions.
No, no, no. I have said throughout that I defer to your legal expertise, and it's certainly not that I haven't bothered to read what you posted - I probably just wasn't capable of understanding it properly. Your reference to "the judicial aithihsve" and your assertion that "their is nothing wrong" went slightly over my head, I must admit. But I'm simply trying to gain a greater understanding of the law of contract based on your input.

You know, I was aware of the rumours: whispered conversations in the corridors of the RCJ; urgent discussions during international arbitration conferences; panicked phone calls by litigation partners at magic circle firms..."there's a bloke from Spennymoor who posts on the messageboard of a non-league football team that he doesn't even support, and he can assess with absolute certainty whether a breach of contract has occurred...WITHOUT EVEN SEEING THE CONTRACT IN QUESTION!" "Oh my god! But you must just mean that he knows that a contract will be void for illegality?" "No. He applies...THE RULES OF NATURAL JUSTICE!"

Copies of Chitty on Contracts are being pulped in their thousands. The entire Commercial Court bench are rumoured to be on the verge of resignation. The LCIA has shut down its operations.

Meanwhile, private members' clubs up and down the country are declaring bankruptcy because they couldn't afford to appoint an independent tribunal every time they might want to expel a member. County FAs are having to return tens millions of pounds they have levied in fines for bookings to players. The refereeing profession is in crisis.

Up and down the country, the cry goes up: "Might there have been a breach of contract?" "Call the Spennymoor Sumption!"

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:12 pm

Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:09 pm
spen666 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:31 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:34 am
spen666 wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:23 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:56 pm


This is excellent. I've needed an explanation of the concept of breach of contract for quite some time now, so I'm very grateful to you for providing it. Who knew that it was so famous and long-standing a legal principle?!

It doesn't actually answer the question I asked, though, which was how you could be so sure that a "legal claim" (as you put it) would be successful if its cause of action was 'a breach of "the rules of Natural Justice"'. I don't want to get bogged down in details, but that is an important point and your further educated input on that would definitely be helpful.

In any event, notwithstanding how grateful I am to you for your irrelevant explanation, could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim? I'm sure you'll agree that citing the particulars of breach with sufficient particularity, and knowing the correct forum in which to issue a claim, are both supremely important when pleading a case for breach of contract; and that for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract had occurred without having sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule.

Really looking forward to your further input on these points. As I've said previously, we're incredibly lucky on this forum to have the input of such an amazing legal mind, who - despite being unable to punctuate or spell - doesn't let those deficiencies (which would normally be fatal to a legal career) hold him back from opining with such accuracy and insight on all things legal.
How can I be sure a claim would succeed?

The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case.

(The NL have already back pedalled on this and announced charges will be heard by an independent tribunal)

I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding. It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial.
"Could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim...because for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract would be certain to succeed without having had sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule?"

I'll take your lack of response to this as a no. Looking forward to your further input, though, because this is the crux of the issue and - given you're such a talented lawyer - it's important that we get to the bottom of this.

"The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case [sic]."

I'm sorry? What exactly are you trying to say here? For such a high-powered legal mind, you seem to have a great deal of difficulty expressing yourself. Anybody might think you aren't actually all that talented in legal matters, but of course we know that's not true, because you've told us so. I'm trying, and utterly failing, to imagine how to plead this case that you describe as a certain win; but no doubt that's because your legal talents are so much more developed than those of anybody else on this forum.

"I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding."

Where to begin with this? It's all but impossible to do so, since you still - after having been asked three times - haven't said exactly what the cause of action would be for this "legal claim", nor in which forum it should be issued. Are you actually suggesting that you can be "sure" that an unspecified claim (which you've suggested might be for breach of contract, without even having identified the contract which has been breached), with an unspecified cause of action, and an unspecified plea for relief, would succeed? Do you even understand how precedent works? This is really pretty basic stuff, and to be honest I'm beginning to wonder whether you're quite as talented in legal matters as you've held yourself out to be; please don't let me down, here.

"It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial."

Oh dear. I'm sure you know that randomly capitalising words doesn't give them any greater force in a legal context (perhaps you are somehow suggesting that "Natural Justice" is a defined term?). It's really disappointing to see such a loose use of language from a peerless legal talent like you. I'm also troubled by the conflation of criminal and civil law by the "Spennymoor Sumption".

Really looking forward as always to your clarification in relation to the above - these are important legal issues, and it's crucial that we have the input of the best legal minds available. Far be it from me to criticise somebody with your weight of legal intellect, but it would probably help your audience if in future you could formulate your legal wisdom in comprehensible sentences.


Yawn yawn

Yes Ritchie you are clearly the king of legal knowledge and all the judicial aithihsve got it wrong and their is nothing wrong with the same body being judge and prosecution in a case.

The courts through history have got it wrong

There is no such thing as a breach of Natural Justice

You may think you are being clever, but all your points have been answered if you bothered to read what is posted, including the precedent cases referred to. Try reading the Enderby Town case for example or the Showmanship Guild case, they answer your questions.
No, no, no. I have said throughout that I defer to your legal expertise, and it's certainly not that I haven't bothered to read what you posted - I probably just wasn't capable of understanding it properly. Your reference to "the judicial aithihsve" and your assertion that "their is nothing wrong" went slightly over my head, I must admit. But I'm simply trying to gain a greater understanding of the law of contract based on your input.

You know, I was aware of the rumours: whispered conversations in the corridors of the RCJ; urgent discussions during international arbitration conferences; panicked phone calls by litigation partners at magic circle firms..."there's a bloke from Spennymoor who posts on the messageboard of a non-league football team that he doesn't even support, and he can assess with absolute certainty whether a breach of contract has occurred...WITHOUT EVEN SEEING THE CONTRACT IN QUESTION!" "Oh my god! But you must just mean that he knows that a contract will be void for illegality?" "No. He applies...THE RULES OF NATURAL JUSTICE!"

Copies of Chitty on Contracts are being pulped in their thousands. The entire Commercial Court bench are rumoured to be on the verge of resignation. The LCIA has shut down its operations.

Meanwhile, private members' clubs up and down the country are declaring bankruptcy because they couldn't afford to appoint an independent tribunal every time they might want to expel a member. County FAs are having to return tens millions of pounds they have levied in fines for bookings to players. The refereeing profession is in crisis.

Up and down the country, the cry goes up: "Might there have been a breach of contract?" "Call the Spennymoor Sumption!"
I'm done with this, anyway. It's increasingly bringing to mind the saying that you shouldn't argue with an idiot, because the best possible outcome is that you win an argument with an idiot.

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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by biccynana » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:19 pm

Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:12 pm
Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:09 pm
spen666 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:31 am
Richie_darlo wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 12:34 am
spen666 wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:23 am


How can I be sure a claim would succeed?

The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case.

(The NL have already back pedalled on this and announced charges will be heard by an independent tribunal)

I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding. It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial.
"Could you point me to the specific contractual breach that has occurred in this instance, and the contractual dispute resolution provisions that would apply in the event of a claim...because for a lawyer to assert that a claim for breach of contract would be certain to succeed without having had sight of the contract in question would be to invite ridicule?"

I'll take your lack of response to this as a no. Looking forward to your further input, though, because this is the crux of the issue and - given you're such a talented lawyer - it's important that we get to the bottom of this.

"The claim being on basis NL were to bring charges & appoint the sub committee to decide the case [sic]."

I'm sorry? What exactly are you trying to say here? For such a high-powered legal mind, you seem to have a great deal of difficulty expressing yourself. Anybody might think you aren't actually all that talented in legal matters, but of course we know that's not true, because you've told us so. I'm trying, and utterly failing, to imagine how to plead this case that you describe as a certain win; but no doubt that's because your legal talents are so much more developed than those of anybody else on this forum.

"I can be sure, because there is precedent for such claims succeeding."

Where to begin with this? It's all but impossible to do so, since you still - after having been asked three times - haven't said exactly what the cause of action would be for this "legal claim", nor in which forum it should be issued. Are you actually suggesting that you can be "sure" that an unspecified claim (which you've suggested might be for breach of contract, without even having identified the contract which has been breached), with an unspecified cause of action, and an unspecified plea for relief, would succeed? Do you even understand how precedent works? This is really pretty basic stuff, and to be honest I'm beginning to wonder whether you're quite as talented in legal matters as you've held yourself out to be; please don't let me down, here.

"It is the most blatant breach of Natural Justice to have the prosecution decide on guilt in a contested trial."

Oh dear. I'm sure you know that randomly capitalising words doesn't give them any greater force in a legal context (perhaps you are somehow suggesting that "Natural Justice" is a defined term?). It's really disappointing to see such a loose use of language from a peerless legal talent like you. I'm also troubled by the conflation of criminal and civil law by the "Spennymoor Sumption".

Really looking forward as always to your clarification in relation to the above - these are important legal issues, and it's crucial that we have the input of the best legal minds available. Far be it from me to criticise somebody with your weight of legal intellect, but it would probably help your audience if in future you could formulate your legal wisdom in comprehensible sentences.


Yawn yawn

Yes Ritchie you are clearly the king of legal knowledge and all the judicial aithihsve got it wrong and their is nothing wrong with the same body being judge and prosecution in a case.

The courts through history have got it wrong

There is no such thing as a breach of Natural Justice

You may think you are being clever, but all your points have been answered if you bothered to read what is posted, including the precedent cases referred to. Try reading the Enderby Town case for example or the Showmanship Guild case, they answer your questions.
No, no, no. I have said throughout that I defer to your legal expertise, and it's certainly not that I haven't bothered to read what you posted - I probably just wasn't capable of understanding it properly. Your reference to "the judicial aithihsve" and your assertion that "their is nothing wrong" went slightly over my head, I must admit. But I'm simply trying to gain a greater understanding of the law of contract based on your input.

You know, I was aware of the rumours: whispered conversations in the corridors of the RCJ; urgent discussions during international arbitration conferences; panicked phone calls by litigation partners at magic circle firms..."there's a bloke from Spennymoor who posts on the messageboard of a non-league football team that he doesn't even support, and he can assess with absolute certainty whether a breach of contract has occurred...WITHOUT EVEN SEEING THE CONTRACT IN QUESTION!" "Oh my god! But you must just mean that he knows that a contract will be void for illegality?" "No. He applies...THE RULES OF NATURAL JUSTICE!"

Copies of Chitty on Contracts are being pulped in their thousands. The entire Commercial Court bench are rumoured to be on the verge of resignation. The LCIA has shut down its operations.

Meanwhile, private members' clubs up and down the country are declaring bankruptcy because they couldn't afford to appoint an independent tribunal every time they might want to expel a member. County FAs are having to return tens millions of pounds they have levied in fines for bookings to players. The refereeing profession is in crisis.

Up and down the country, the cry goes up: "Might there have been a breach of contract?" "Call the Spennymoor Sumption!"
I'm done with this, anyway. It's increasingly bringing to mind the saying that you shouldn't argue with an idiot, because the best possible outcome is that you win an argument with an idiot.
Hasn't someone on this board got that as their sig?

My personal fave along those lines is “Never wrestle with pigs. You both get dirty but the pig likes it” (George Bernard Shaw).

Vokuhila
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Vokuhila » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:55 pm

biccynana wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:19 pm
Hasn't someone on this board got that as their sig?
Yes, Lawman3 :thumbup:

Richie_darlo
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:04 am

biccynana wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:19 pm

My personal fave along those lines is “Never wrestle with pigs. You both get dirty but the pig likes it” (George Bernard Shaw).
Also v good. I'd like to think that - especially given the ongoing silence from him - the metaphorical pig in this particular case has come off the dirtier, and hasn't liked it; but I say that more in hope than in expectation, given his previous form.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:37 pm

"In these circumstances we believe that we have been misled by the National League, and therefore an objective independent person would consider it wholly unreasonable to require us to play matches until there is resolution to the financial and safety issues that have been known by the National League for many weeks."

The above is taken from the club statement and it's a good point. To me D.J. is saying (and I paraphrase)
'if it comes to it, make sure it's someone independent who judges us on this'

This is maybe what Spen is trying to put across? But he does it in such a condescending manner.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

Richie_darlo
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Richie_darlo » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:45 pm

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:37 pm
"In these circumstances we believe that we have been misled by the National League, and therefore an objective independent person would consider it wholly unreasonable to require us to play matches until there is resolution to the financial and safety issues that have been known by the National League for many weeks."

The above is taken from the club statement and it's a good point. To me D.J. is saying (and I paraphrase)
'if it comes to it, make sure it's someone independent who judges us on this'

This is maybe what Spen is trying to put across? But he does it in such a condescending manner.
I think DJ is just appealing to common sense and decency in this statement (and I completely agree with him). What he's not doing, because unlike some he's a competent and diligent professional, is making claims of absolute knowledge in the face of complex legal and factual issues.

I think you're being charitable to Spen, which is admirable, and would normally be my take on things; I just think that I've seen enough of his pomposity and two-faced behaviour that I no longer need to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I completely agree that he is condescending, but he was also fundamentally wrong in the claims of absolute knowledge he was making. Being condescending when you're talented is an unattractive character trait; but being condescending when you're actually clueless just marks you out as a bit of a pathetic individual. "Spen666" uses this forum, presumably, to attempt to make himself feel better about himself by sneering at other posters who he thinks are less intelligent than him. There's another saying - and I'm paraphrasing - that you rarely hear somebody who is actually intelligent boasting about how intelligent they are. The posts of "Spen666" on this board are a pretty good indication that that's probably true.

Darlopj
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by Darlopj » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:59 pm

spen666 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:28 am
Quaker85 wrote:
Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:14 am
I’m no legal expert but what I do know is that the legal profession is very adept at constructing sentences and the use of language, especially in the spelling department. Spen is not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You want me to write message board posts in legalease? Happy to do so, but most people will not understand it and complain about the use of such language

For example, I could have referred to the remedies of Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available to a claimant. Does that make sense to the average reader of this board?
No we don't want you to write posts in legalease. We just want you to wind your neck in and Foxtrot Oscar off this forum.

Ok you've got the reaction you obviously crave, from me at least, but do us all a favour and do one.

jjljks
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Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:25 am
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Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by jjljks » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:16 am

Why does Spen666 think we want to sign more players?
"Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available"
They are probably cup-tied & illegible for the Trophy (or am I not reading that write😉)

joejaques
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Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 10:36 am
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Location: Milford Haven

Re: DFC Voted for League to be Null & Void

Post by joejaques » Thu Feb 18, 2021 9:17 am

jjljks wrote:
Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:16 am
Why does Spen666 think we want to sign more players?
"Certiorari or Mandamus as being potentially available"
They are probably cup-tied & illegible for the Trophy (or am I not reading that write😉)
If they are coming in from abroad, their hotel quarantine won't be over by the time of the Hornchurch game. :D :roll:
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