Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

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Old Git
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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Old Git » Sat Feb 27, 2021 6:31 pm

Was not entirely sure if the ref showed 2 yellow cards to Hatfield or whether he showed a straight red on the second occasion. Does anyone know whether it will carry over to next season and cause him to be suspended in August?
On another point if Quaker TV is operating next season please don’t invite Hodgy back. Love the guy but was a bit disrespectful to Hornchurch at times.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by onewayup » Sat Feb 27, 2021 6:36 pm

It's done we are now out of the trophy. Biggest winner today thw guy who won 50/50 good day for him.and hornchurch. Lest said soonest mended.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:01 pm

Has anyone else spotted that outrageous Notts County goal in The Trophy :shock:

Just what we needed today, someone who knows where the goal is.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by JE93 » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:13 pm

A really poor way to finish the season and all of our own making. Ref was poor, some bad decisions, but generally just in the way of play as well. Credit to Hornchurch they got the result, but honestly we should be doing better. They looked badly short of fitness but we were poor on the ball and didn't make them chase the game. We just played down the throats of the big CBs for a large proportion of the game.

The 4-4-2 didn't work as well without Charman. He adds so much to our attack but there were still enough chances for us to score goals, 17 I think our shot count for the day, but its not just about shooting from anywhere its the quality of chance created. Think Sousa has been brilliant this season but if he took the blinkers off sometimes he'd be in league 2, just a simple pass sometimes when he takes on the shot. Thought Wheatley was unusually scruffy today.

But our issue was the same as it has been all season. Catch us with just a little pace in behind and we fall to pieces. We need to really think about how we defend we either need to defend deeper and not allow the space in behind. Or we have to look for personnel who are quick enough that they can recover.

Nothing competitive now till August and we need to improve next season if we're going to be a playoff team. I'd say the squad is 85% there but we really need to fill some key positions to give ourselves a chance.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by 50 years » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:49 pm

Really disappointed, not so much because we lost, but the way we played. Hornchurch were not a bad team, controlled the ball well, didn't waste balls, were able to pass to there players and must have done there homework on us as they had runners for balls put through, and had several other good chances with several one on ones with the keeper, requiring some last ditch interceptions. Where we often gave the ball away.

Darlo did not play as they have against the higher league teams, so maybe overconfidence?

Maguire was not at the races today, which was explained in AA interview with him being ill and not able to train, I did struggle to understand why he was kept on to be honest as he wasn't getting involved (unlike the way he has been playing lately). We virtually played 4-2-4, which leave our 2 midfielders running all over and out of position. If Charmers had been fit it may have made a difference, but having 4 not very tall / physical forward playing players does not seem to work for us.

I personally think we have some good players, but AA has some hard decisions now as they may not be able to play consistently as a team capable of really challenging for promotion for next season, not easy for him.

Still something positive, fans may be allowed back in August :thumbup:

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Old Git » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:57 pm

Listening to AA in his post match interview it was a straight red for Hatfield.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by real_darlo_85 » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:59 pm

I do have more hope of better things and progress under AA but I think one major thing that let's down his team's is consistency. I think at Blyth it was the same to an extent and it does seem to have happened to us over the past season and what ever this season has been. We either win or lose, with not many savvy draws to maintain momentum or stop a rot, building on this is key for 21/22.

I think we know where are weaknesses are and if most of the current squad is retained then, potential is there for progress. It's been a pretty frustrating season and for it to end in this manner just adds to it, roll on summer I guess...!
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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by quakersfan » Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:08 pm

Disappointing result but probably a fair result and good luck to Hornchurch moving on. Roll on new season hopefully where we can watch without a mask.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by darlobaz791 » Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:15 pm

Hugely disappointing today. Very easy with hindsight but we needed the extra midfielder today to keep the ball. I really like Sousa but I don’t know if he heard a scout was watching or something today as he wanted to do everything himself. I don’t know why Hudson hasn’t been given more of a chance. We needed some spark today and with the little we have seen of him he could’ve provided it. Onto next season...

Out: Saltmer, McMahon (as a player), Liddle, Hunt, Rivers, Reid, Atkinson, Watson

Keep: Storey, Hedley, Hatfield, Wheatley, Charman, Sousa, Holness

TBC: Campbell, Maguire, Hudson

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Old Git » Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:27 pm

darlobaz791 wrote:
Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:15 pm
Hugely disappointing today. Very easy with hindsight but we needed the extra midfielder today to keep the ball. I really like Sousa but I don’t know if he heard a scout was watching or something today as he wanted to do everything himself. I don’t know why Hudson hasn’t been given more of a chance. We needed some spark today and with the little we have seen of him he could’ve provided it. Onto next season...

Out: Saltmer, McMahon (as a player), Liddle, Hunt, Rivers, Reid, Atkinson, Watson

Keep: Storey, Hedley, Hatfield, Wheatley, Charman, Sousa, Holness

TBC: Campbell, Maguire, Hudson
Don’t think AA will be quite as severe with his squad trimming as you are predicting. He has been loyal to his ex Blyth band of players but it could be the end for Reid Watson and Atkinson as non of them have really excelled recently.

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Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlogramps » Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:33 pm

darlobaz791 wrote:Hugely disappointing today. Very easy with hindsight but we needed the extra midfielder today to keep the ball. I really like Sousa but I don’t know if he heard a scout was watching or something today as he wanted to do everything himself. I don’t know why Hudson hasn’t been given more of a chance. We needed some spark today and with the little we have seen of him he could’ve provided it. Onto next season...

Out: Saltmer, McMahon (as a player), Liddle, Hunt, Rivers, Reid, Atkinson, Watson

Keep: Storey, Hedley, Hatfield, Wheatley, Charman, Sousa, Holness

TBC: Campbell, Maguire, Hudson
Ah yes, the old absent player syndrome.

Whereby a player not involved is immediately seen as being much better than he actually is.

Case in point: Theo Hudson.

You think he would provide a spark. Can you give an example of when he’s done that.

Also, the idea you’re on the fence about whether Campbell and Maguire should stay is daft. And keeping Hudson over Liddle and Rivers? Don’t make me laugh.

FWIW, I’d let Atkinson go. I think Reid gets harshly judged and his versatility is important. Same for Watson. Couldn’t care less about Hudson, and I think Holness will have another crack at getting a full time club.

AA is on record saying we need another GK and CM and someone else in defence. So there’d probably be a question mark about Hunt and/or Laing.

I don’t necessarily disagree with the idea AA can be too loyal to his ex-Blyth contingent. But in my opinion you’re being harsh on the likes of Liddle and Rivers, who have performed pretty well, generally speaking.
Last edited by Darlogramps on Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by JE93 » Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:45 pm

darlobaz791 wrote:
Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:15 pm
Hugely disappointing today. Very easy with hindsight but we needed the extra midfielder today to keep the ball. I really like Sousa but I don’t know if he heard a scout was watching or something today as he wanted to do everything himself. I don’t know why Hudson hasn’t been given more of a chance. We needed some spark today and with the little we have seen of him he could’ve provided it. Onto next season...

Out: Saltmer, McMahon (as a player), Liddle, Hunt, Rivers, Reid, Atkinson, Watson

Keep: Storey, Hedley, Hatfield, Wheatley, Charman, Sousa, Holness

TBC: Campbell, Maguire, Hudson
Can't see it being that drastic and personally I don't think it needs to be. Its a squad game, Watson is a solid enough LB cover and I'd imagine for the level he's fairly reasonable cost wise. Reid if he's in the match squad can cover 3 positions. I wouldn't be rushing to get rid of either. I'd keep Liddle and Rivers too. Rivers has been excellent in lots of big matches this season, Swindon and Wealdstone to name 2 examples. I'd also keep Campbell, Maguire and Mcmahon.

Laing and Holmes would have to be non contract terms at best until they were both fit.

Other side of things is that I think we need to move players who Armstrong doesn't seem to trust or want to play. Hudson, Saltmer could even potentially add Holness to that list. Dont think they've particularly done anything wrong but no point keeping players who don't play and in reality a team our size cant carry a bloated squad.

Need a GK, 2xCB's, CM and another wide player

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Vodka_Vic » Sat Feb 27, 2021 8:58 pm

Nasser Hussain always says 'You're a better player out of the side'
I agree with a lot of JE93's logic.
AA said after his interview today that things have to change and will change for next year. He also said that he knows where we need to strengthen, and that he needs about 3 changes, and criticised the central defenders. He's done that on more than one occasion next year, so my feeling is one of Hunt and Storey will go.
He said he needs more cover in midfield as well, so I think someone will come in there. Regarding Hudson, he's said a few times that he's not ready yet. Whether he retains him as a future asset, I'm not so sure of.
There won't be wholesale changes like some think. AA has said us much and as much as people don't like to hear it, a club with our budget needs squad players like Reid and Watson, especially a utility player like Reid who will not be on big bucks.
This shortened season has been useful in that it has given AA a chance to look at what we need more of to get up there challenging. We clearly have a soft underbelly and I think he'll be inclined to give Atkinson a full season. Holmes will return as a forward too.
So my views, for what it's worth:

Out: one of Hunt/Storey, or both
Hudson

In: Midfielder (Lambert?), 2 central defenders (Laing will be out most of next season)
Keeper - he'll either have 2 keepers or let Saltmer go. Would love to see Minter in.

So that's it. I don't think there'll be huge changes, and with a full preseason we can work on this soft underbelly and grind out more wins and draws next year. When he said things will change, perhaps he was talking about himself as well. He's very open about the fact that he's still fairly new as a manager and that his teams get few draws and he goes full out attack. Maybe as a manager he'll be more pragmatic and go for a more compact system where we grind out more draws.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlofan97 » Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:14 pm

We have the basis of a good squad at this level;

Retain on a contract: McMahon, Hedley, Storey, Liddle, Watson, Hatfield, Wheatley, Reid, Rivers, Sousa, Charman, Campbell, Maguire

Retain on a non-contract basis: Laing (ACL/MCL injury), Atkinson, Holmes (ACL injury)

Sign: GK, CB (x2) & CM.

Hunt is a strange one. At times he looks a class above, other times not so much. He is 38 in September and I am unsure if he would be willing to commit to the commute again.

I suspect Saltmer, Holness & Hudson will depart.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by en passant » Sat Feb 27, 2021 11:38 pm

And what about up front? Are we happy with the forwards we have? We appeared to be missing Charman today. So what is the answer when he cannot play? And against sides that have big no nonsense defenders do we need a bid no nonsense attacker to mix things up and provide a plan B?

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sat Feb 27, 2021 11:57 pm

As the evening's moved on I've become a tad annoyed about this result today, as we've missed such a good opportunity here :thumbdown:

The reoccurring problem with this present team is that we can't beat the scrappy, men behind the ball type teams that turn up at Blackwell Meadows, yet we can quite frequently beat teams that are deemed 'better' than us on paper. This is so bloody frustrating.


And it's all very well Hodgie banging on constantly about fitness levels and suchlike all through his commentary but at the end of the day that didn't have a bearing on the result. Tubby Hornchurch were workmanlike, kept together and took their chances when they were gifted to them - and good luck to them too, but this game today really should have been won by us and we cocked it up.
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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:07 am

en passant wrote:
Sat Feb 27, 2021 11:38 pm
And what about up front? Are we happy with the forwards we have? We appeared to be missing Charman today. So what is the answer when he cannot play? And against sides that have big no nonsense defenders do we need a bid no nonsense attacker to mix things up and provide a plan B?
We can bring in a loanee if we are struggling with injuries.

I don't honestly believe going forward is our issue. Yes, we need to sharpen up, but we create plenty of chances and have averaged almost 2 goals per game in all competitions.

The biggest priority for me is strengthening the goalkeeper and defence. It's imperative we get the goalkeeping situation right; we've used 5 different goalkeepers since Alun was appointed and almost a 6th if Boney made his debut. That can't be great for continuity and building confidence.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:26 am

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Sat Feb 27, 2021 11:57 pm
As the evening's moved on I've become a tad annoyed about this result today, as we've missed such a good opportunity here :thumbdown:

The reoccurring problem with this present team is that we can't beat the scrappy, men behind the ball type teams that turn up at Blackwell Meadows, yet we can quite frequently beat teams that are deemed 'better' than us on paper. This is so bloody frustrating.


And it's all very well Hodgie banging on constantly about fitness levels and suchlike all through his commentary but at the end of the day that didn't have a bearing on the result. Tubby Hornchurch were workmanlike, kept together and took their chances when they were gifted to them - and good luck to them too, but this game today really should have been won by us and we cocked it up.
We haven't won a match, or even drawn, when going the first goal behind this season (7 times).

That's the reoccurring theme you have alluded to and it's correct.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by H1987 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:49 am

Darlofan97 wrote:
Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:14 pm
We have the basis of a good squad at this level;

Retain on a contract: McMahon, Hedley, Storey, Liddle, Watson, Hatfield, Wheatley, Reid, Rivers, Sousa, Charman, Campbell, Maguire

Retain on a non-contract basis: Laing (ACL/MCL injury), Atkinson, Holmes (ACL injury)

Sign: GK, CB (x2) & CM.

Hunt is a strange one. At times he looks a class above, other times not so much. He is 38 in September and I am unsure if he would be willing to commit to the commute again.

I suspect Saltmer, Holness & Hudson will depart.
I don't know about Saltmer and Holness.... I don't really know who the takers would be. I think they'll be offered contracts here and it might be drawn out like Holness last year... It's a funny one. Most clubs at our level won't have much money and the level above, I don't think they've done quite enough to get that move up another level. I'm hoping we hold onto what we have, which I think in the current climate it reasonably likely, and then we can add a couple of extra players as AA suggested at the fans forum. I think a keeper is a must, we can't just have one on the books.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:04 am

H1987 wrote:
Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:49 am
Darlofan97 wrote:
Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:14 pm
We have the basis of a good squad at this level;

Retain on a contract: McMahon, Hedley, Storey, Liddle, Watson, Hatfield, Wheatley, Reid, Rivers, Sousa, Charman, Campbell, Maguire

Retain on a non-contract basis: Laing (ACL/MCL injury), Atkinson, Holmes (ACL injury)

Sign: GK, CB (x2) & CM.

Hunt is a strange one. At times he looks a class above, other times not so much. He is 38 in September and I am unsure if he would be willing to commit to the commute again.

I suspect Saltmer, Holness & Hudson will depart.
I don't know about Saltmer and Holness.... I don't really know who the takers would be. I think they'll be offered contracts here and it might be drawn out like Holness last year... It's a funny one. Most clubs at our level won't have much money and the level above, I don't think they've done quite enough to get that move up another level. I'm hoping we hold onto what we have, which I think in the current climate it reasonably likely, and then we can add a couple of extra players as AA suggested at the fans forum. I think a keeper is a must, we can't just have one on the books.
Having two first-team goalkeepers at this level is a waste of the playing budget, especially for a club like ours.

Jameson or the loan market is the way to go.

I get the impression that AA is not fully convinced by Saltmer as, to put it quite bluntly, he has signed 3 other goalkeepers since signing him in the summer. He will be released rather than signed up from higher up.

Holness has no ties to the area, is non-contract, and we haven’t (again) been giving him minutes on the pitch. He will probably not want to stay.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by jjljks » Sun Feb 28, 2021 7:16 am

Before signing anyone, check if they have had 2 jabs of vaccine!

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by DarloJason » Sun Feb 28, 2021 9:12 am

As soon as I heard Hodgy putting down their team I was concerned it could comeback and bite him. However, I think during his commentary he raised some really good coaching points. I do wonder how much time AA has had to work on the squad and improve their individual game play. To do this there does have to be the capacity in the players to improve.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by QUAKERMAN2 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 9:32 am

DarloJason wrote:As soon as I heard Hodgy putting down their team I was concerned it could comeback and bite him. However, I think during his commentary he raised some really good coaching points. I do wonder how much time AA has had to work on the squad and improve their individual game play. To do this there does have to be the capacity in the players to improve.
One of his main criticisms was the decision making of our forwards, taking too many touches and making wrong options.He was spot on and really enjoyed listening to his comments.Great to have him around the club again.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by onewayup » Sun Feb 28, 2021 10:05 am

In the cold light of day we were beaten by a side that wanted it more than us,we didn't cotton on to the long ball time and time again, as they punished us with it , it was our mistakes that gave them the opportunity to play long balls, a bad pass interception and away they go.
Same mistake both goals from our losing possession. You just can't do that no matter what league you play.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Old Git » Sun Feb 28, 2021 11:00 am

I enjoy being controversial at times so here is a suggestion that might cause some discussion. Release Campbell.
Reason 1. Not really an effective enough striker because of his size. Maguire and Charman look like our most potent strikers when fit and could be the way to go next season.
Reason 2. We have more effective wide men in Sousa and Rivers who have more pace and are better cutting in from the flanks.
Reason 3. Campbell likely to be a high wage earner.
If Holmes can regain his fitness we will be reasonably stocked with wide offensive players. If we can add another physically strong attacker to the squad we should have all options covered.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlofan97 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 11:06 am

Old Git wrote:
Sun Feb 28, 2021 11:00 am
I enjoy being controversial at times so here is a suggestion that might cause some discussion. Release Campbell.
Reason 1. Not really an effective enough striker because of his size. Maguire and Charman look like our most potent strikers when fit and could be the way to go next season.
Reason 2. We have more effective wide men in Sousa and Rivers who have more pace and are better cutting in from the flanks.
Reason 3. Campbell likely to be a high wage earner.
If Holmes can regain his fitness we will be reasonably stocked with wide offensive players. If we can add another physically strong attacker to the squad we should have all options covered.
We need to keep Campbell, IMO.

He one of our most technically gifted - and creative - player that can play either side and upfront.

He is also someone you can rely on to be - predominately - fit and available for selection.

When he plays upfront he maybe does require an O'Neill/Charman style player alongside him, but that isn't a good enough reason to release him.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by 50 years » Sun Feb 28, 2021 11:39 am

I personally have no idea who I would release, I like them all on there day. Some have mentioned Atkinson, but imo I think he was an excellent technical player, (besides that 10 mins in the cup), so would keep him depending on fitness.

The players now have time to recover from injuries, and build there fitness ready for next season. Roll on next season, I trust in AA's judgement.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Darlogramps » Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:25 pm

Old Git wrote:I enjoy being controversial at times so here is a suggestion that might cause some discussion. Release Campbell.
Reason 1. Not really an effective enough striker because of his size. Maguire and Charman look like our most potent strikers when fit and could be the way to go next season.
Reason 2. We have more effective wide men in Sousa and Rivers who have more pace and are better cutting in from the flanks.
Reason 3. Campbell likely to be a high wage earner.
If Holmes can regain his fitness we will be reasonably stocked with wide offensive players. If we can add another physically strong attacker to the squad we should have all options covered.
Campbell was our top scorer last season, with 15 in a curtailed campaign, and 2nd top scorer this season. So I disagree that he’s not effective enough as a striker. He’s also pretty effective at linking up the play as well.

Clearly his preferred role is as a more withdrawn 10 role. He’s not a poacher like Maguire so I don’t think he should be judged as that.

I’d also add that him and Charman are two of our most “sellable” assets. They’re the most likely to be picked up for a fee, along with Sousa, Storey and Hatfield. Worth keeping for that alone.

Interestingly, all of Charman’s goals came in the cups. He didn’t score a single league goal this season.
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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Alfie » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:06 pm

DarloJason wrote:
Sun Feb 28, 2021 9:12 am
As soon as I heard Hodgy putting down their team I was concerned it could comeback and bite him. However, I think during his commentary he raised some really good coaching points. I do wonder how much time AA has had to work on the squad and improve their individual game play. To do this there does have to be the capacity in the players to improve.
One of the downsides of being part-time I suppose. A couple of sessions a week severley limits the time you can work with individual players to improve particular aspects of their game. Full time the coach can drill things in to them day after day so they become part of the players natural decision making - if they have the capacity to understand and implement them of course.

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Re: Darlington V Hornchurch Trophy Quarter Final

Post by Old Git » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:33 pm

Darlogramps wrote:
Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:25 pm
Old Git wrote:I enjoy being controversial at times so here is a suggestion that might cause some discussion. Release Campbell.
Reason 1. Not really an effective enough striker because of his size. Maguire and Charman look like our most potent strikers when fit and could be the way to go next season.
Reason 2. We have more effective wide men in Sousa and Rivers who have more pace and are better cutting in from the flanks.
Reason 3. Campbell likely to be a high wage earner.
If Holmes can regain his fitness we will be reasonably stocked with wide offensive players. If we can add another physically strong attacker to the squad we should have all options covered.
Campbell was our top scorer last season, with 15 in a curtailed campaign, and 2nd top scorer this season. So I disagree that he’s not effective enough as a striker. He’s also pretty effective at linking up the play as well.

Clearly his preferred role is as a more withdrawn 10 role. He’s not a poacher like Maguire so I don’t think he should be judged as that.

I’d also add that him and Charman are two of our most “sellable” assets. They’re the most likely to be picked up for a fee, along with Sousa, Storey and Hatfield. Worth keeping for that alone.

Interestingly, all of Charman’s goals came in the cups. He didn’t score a single league goal this season.
For me Charman and Sousa are our most saleable assets as both look to have the potential to play at a higher level. Campbell did well last season but has looked a bit lost this time around. Unfortunately he has neither a physical presence or great pace. He does link play up but I beginning to think he is a bit of a luxury at this level of football.
Will always remember his 2 goals at Swindon but that apart struggling to remember him having much of an impact in most games. Not sure there would be a lengthy cue of clubs from a higher level looking to sign him.

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