Punishment for the Boston game

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Darlogramps
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Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Darlogramps » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:02 pm

£2k fine and a suspended 2pt deduction (Or 1.4K if we accepted the charge).

Interesting to see how the board react, given they were confident at the fans’ forum.

It’s a total joke. Clubs couldn’t afford to play, but are being penalised anyway. And a financial penalty for clubs who are struggling financially anyway.


“An Independent Panel has ruled that 16 Member Clubs participating in National League North and South (Step Two) are guilty of breaching Rule 8.39 for failing to meet fixture obligations.

Fines ranging from £1,400 to £8,000 in addition to a suspended points deduction for the 2021/22 Playing Season has been issued to each Member Club found guilty.

Given the extremely unusual circumstances that have affected football at all levels and the financial pressures the absence of spectators has brought to bear on clubs, the Panel expressed its sympathy with the Clubs’ predicament. However, the Panel believes it must also take regard of the fact that the majority of Clubs continued to fulfil fixtures and incur much costs until the League ended on February 19th.

Per breach, each Club received a £2,000 fine and suspended two-point deduction for the 2021/22 Playing Season. A 30% deduction was made to the fine for those accepting the charge ahead of the hearing.”
Last edited by Darlogramps on Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by tdk1 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:04 pm

What. The. Fuck.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by eddie-rowles » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:17 pm

This absolutely makes my blood boil our league is run by a bunch of incompetent, immoral spineless back stabbing arse####s . We lost over £100k this year already because no one took minutes on whether grants or loans was discussed any fines or points deductions for the secretary NO!
I hope every team kicks up a s*** storm

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by spen666 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:26 pm

Darlogramps wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:02 pm
£2k fine and a suspended 2pt deduction (Or 1.4K if we accepted the charge).

Interesting to see how the board react, given they were confident at the fans’ forum.

It’s a total joke. Clubs couldn’t afford to play, but are being penalised anyway. And a financial penalty for clubs who are struggling financially anyway.


“An Independent Panel has ruled that 16 Member Clubs participating in National League North and South (Step Two) are guilty of breaching Rule 8.39 for failing to meet fixture obligations.

Fines ranging from £1,400 to £8,000 in addition to a suspended points deduction for the 2021/22 Playing Season has been issued to each Member Club found guilty.

Given the extremely unusual circumstances that have affected football at all levels and the financial pressures the absence of spectators has brought to bear on clubs, the Panel expressed its sympathy with the Clubs’ predicament. However, the Panel believes it must also take regard of the fact that the majority of Clubs continued to fulfil fixtures and incur much costs until the League ended on February 19th.

Per breach, each Club received a £2,000 fine and suspended two-point deduction for the 2021/22 Playing Season. A 30% deduction was made to the fine for those accepting the charge ahead of the hearing.”

For once, I am 100% in agreement with you.

Its a simple money grabbing exercise by the National League.

It would be good to see all the clubs come together about this and kick up a stink. The negative publicity the NL would get, added to the issues around the grants will surely force regime change at the NL

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:34 pm

eddie-rowles wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:17 pm
This absolutely makes my blood boil our league is run by a bunch of incompetent, immoral spineless back stabbing arse####s . We lost over £100k this year already because no one took minutes on whether grants or loans was discussed any fines or points deductions for the secretary NO!
I hope every team kicks up a s*** storm

I couldn't of put it better myself. The people in charge of this league are a complete bunch of dickheads.

In any case, in the case of our game V Boston what would have this game achieved? Absolutely nothing except costs for us and Boston.

The people running this league have no common sense, they needed to calm this situation down not stir up ill feeling.

I predict appeals, possible legal action and very definate bad feeling.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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Old Git
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Old Git » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:36 pm

Think we should pay the fine over 10 years just like the terms of the loan sorry grant they were offering.Works out at just under 4 quid a week.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by joejaques » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:44 pm

How on earth can clubs be sanctioned for not taking part in fixtures that were null and void? It truly defies logic, but given where the decision came from, I suppose we shouldn't be too surprised at the lack of logic. :roll:
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Darlogramps
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Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Darlogramps » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:47 pm

The other thing to remember is next season we’re still not guaranteed in terms of funding.

Let’s say there’s a another COVID wave in the winter, restrictions on fans etc, we could easily be in the same situation.

All the clubs who voted to null and void must not start again, unless there’s a cast iron funding guarantee for the whole campaign in the event of more disruption.

Otherwise the fiasco of the last few months will just happen once again.
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Old Git » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:51 pm

Apparently Bradford PA are fuming as they have received a £6000 fine because they failed to play 3 matches. They say they are going to appeal to the FA and are taking legal advice relating to the lies told to them by the NL at the start of the season.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:58 pm

Old Git wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:51 pm
Apparently Bradford PA are fuming as they have received a £6000 fine because they failed to play 3 matches. They say they are going to appeal to the FA and are taking legal advice relating to the lies told to them by the NL at the start of the season.
Too bloody right. It was always agreed that clubs could appeal anyway. Are these people in charge looking for excitement or something? Are they bored?

And as for Dover!! £40,000 fine. :wtf:
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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lo36789
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by lo36789 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:02 pm

I actually can't believe this. I was sure they had pretty much confirmed these things were just an admin exercise.

It is the clubs who vote the board in...good luck with that.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by JE93 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:03 pm

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:58 pm
Old Git wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:51 pm
Apparently Bradford PA are fuming as they have received a £6000 fine because they failed to play 3 matches. They say they are going to appeal to the FA and are taking legal advice relating to the lies told to them by the NL at the start of the season.
Too bloody right. It was always agreed that clubs could appeal anyway. Are these people in charge looking for excitement or something? Are they bored?

And as for Dover!! £40,000 fine. :wtf:
What makes even less sense is that Dover stopped 15 games into a 44 game league season. All other teams have been charged £2k per game. For Dover that would be £58,000 for their remaining 29 fixtures. Yet they get a £40,000 fine? The league board genuinely do just make it up as they go along.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by lo36789 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:34 pm

JE93 wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:03 pm
theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:58 pm
Old Git wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:51 pm
Apparently Bradford PA are fuming as they have received a £6000 fine because they failed to play 3 matches. They say they are going to appeal to the FA and are taking legal advice relating to the lies told to them by the NL at the start of the season.
Too bloody right. It was always agreed that clubs could appeal anyway. Are these people in charge looking for excitement or something? Are they bored?

And as for Dover!! £40,000 fine. :wtf:
What makes even less sense is that Dover stopped 15 games into a 44 game league season. All other teams have been charged £2k per game. For Dover that would be £58,000 for their remaining 29 fixtures. Yet they get a £40,000 fine? The league board genuinely do just make it up as they go along.
Different tariff for step 1 v step 2? Dover have so far failed to fulfil 10 I think.

They can't be fined for failing to do something that they haven't been scheduled to do yet.

That Dover fine could legitimately rise to £116k I reckon.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Darlopartisan » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:39 pm

Should think a number of clubs will be taking legal action against this ruling, hopefully the clubs involved in these ludicrous fines can come together to fight this.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Darlopartisan » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:59 pm

David Johnston on bbc sport tonight.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:03 pm

lo36789 wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:02 pm
I actually can't believe this. I was sure they had pretty much confirmed these things were just an admin exercise.

It is the clubs who vote the board in...good luck with that.
This is a question I asked you a few weeks back lo, you maybe missed it.

But, can you elaborate on how these league officials are voted in, and more importantly voted out.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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lo36789
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by lo36789 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:18 pm

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:03 pm
lo36789 wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:02 pm
I actually can't believe this. I was sure they had pretty much confirmed these things were just an admin exercise.

It is the clubs who vote the board in...good luck with that.
This is a question I asked you a few weeks back lo, you maybe missed it.

But, can you elaborate on how these league officials are voted in, and more importantly voted out.
League AGM

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by al_quaker » Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:51 pm

A disgraceful day for the National League board. I sincerely hope the national press pick up on this story and they get the coverage they deserve.

And putting it out on a Friday at 5pm. Spineless.

Nobody disputes it's been an incredibly difficult season for everybody, including those running the leagues. But they've seemingly made the wrong decision at every turn. The clubs have been let down constantly.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by en passant » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:25 pm

I would like to think that the FA would have the sense to advise the League on this and suggest they back down. I would also like to think that if this did not happen, that the media and senior football figures would make a stink about it. But when did any of these pay much attention to what was going on in non league football? Sure they love it when plucky Salford with a news worthy back story and famous faces climb the leagues, or do a Chorley in the cup, but the rest of the time they don't spare us much thought. They can talk for hours on MOTD about the unfairness of VAR offside decisions, but a crisis in the lower leagues, threatening the very existence of a goodly number of clubs and their attendant communities hardly raises a murmur. They can talk joyously over a player being a bargain at 20million, but fail to see the inequity of just one such transaction being able to cover the cost of three leagues being able to complete this season instead of descending into this sort of farce.
I think that the National League board have every reason to believe that they can get away with this lunacy because beyond our own local concerns, nobody in football appears to give a toss about our survival.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Mar 26, 2021 10:12 pm

D.J. Has put out a recorded statement on the official website.

And he is angry with a capital A.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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LoidLucan
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by LoidLucan » Fri Mar 26, 2021 11:31 pm

On another level I can really appreciate the tremendous comedic value in the NL's stance. It's a brilliant way to shove yet another stick into the hornets' nest.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by joejaques » Sat Mar 27, 2021 6:48 am

Darlopartisan wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:59 pm
David Johnston on bbc sport tonight.
Link Please? :roll:
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by jjljks » Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:34 am

Amazed at the restraint of our fans as none have called for stringing the NL Board from the nearest crossbar, so keep it up everyone. Rather than line the pockets of lawyers, which many clubs just can not afford, we should be concentrating on how to get rid of them. Who appointed these insensitive, incompetent idiots in the first place? If the Board had any integrity, they would have resigned by now. Perhaps an online petition would be a start? Any other ideas?

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by lo36789 » Sat Mar 27, 2021 8:07 am

jjljks wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:34 am
Who appointed these insensitive, incompetent idiots in the first place? If the Board had any integrity, they would have resigned by now. Perhaps an online petition would be a start? Any other ideas?
They were voted in at the AGM in June by the member clubs. Seems to be around the 10th June.

Based on Companies House it is 4 out and 4 in every year.

We don't need to petition for something we as a club already get a vote on.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sat Mar 27, 2021 8:33 am

There should be an extraordinary AGM (if that is the term) and all of the board should be kicked out.

Furthermore if fans can influence this in any way they should get involved. So I agree with jillks - if anyone has any good ideas, put them up on here.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by Darlofan97 » Sat Mar 27, 2021 8:59 am

According to Ollie Bayliss, National League clubs are discussing proposing a vote of no confidence in the Chairman & Board of the National League.

The only snippet I’ve heard from Brian Barwick in all of this is speaking out in support of commercial deal. It’s absolutely shambolic.

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by JE93 » Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:01 am

Unsurprisingly national league clubs are suggesting a vote of no confidence in the national league board. Will be further discussed between club leaders on Monday to gauge support for calling an EGM and carrying a vote of no confidence to dismiss the current board members.

https://twitter.com/Ollie_Bayliss/statu ... 51589?s=19

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:08 am

Darlofan97 wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 8:59 am
According to Ollie Bayliss, National League clubs are discussing proposing a vote of no confidence in the Chairman & Board of the National League.

The only snippet I’ve heard from Brian Barwick in all of this is speaking out in support of commercial deal. It’s absolutely shambolic.
Bring it on.

Maybe that's what they want?

Thinking about this further, it could work, because even the clubs who haven't been fined (16?) will have a gripe with Ives and co. The likes of Dorking and others who wanted to play on.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by poppyfield » Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:49 am

joejaques wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 6:48 am
Darlopartisan wrote:
Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:59 pm
David Johnston on bbc sport tonight.
Link Please? :roll:
Angry Darlington chief executive David Johnston has hit out at National League, saying their “credibility is gone and I simply do not trust the National League board”.

He was speaking in reaction the league officials today fining the club £2,000 for failing to fulfil a fixture during a season that has been declared null and void, saying the move “smacks of incompetence at the highest level”.

The fixture in question is the home game with Boston United in February, with Darlington one of 16 clubs find today for not playing games despite the impact Covid has had on non-league football.

Johnston points out: “How can the league now finest for something that didn’t happen?”, says Quakers will appeal the decision and “may take legal action”.

A brief statement from Quakers today read: “The club has today received notification from the National League that we have been fined £2,000 for breach of league rule 8.39, for failing to fulfill our home fixture against Boston United on Tuesday 16th February 2021. We have also received a suspended two point deduction.”



However, a frustrated Johnston has this evening spoken on BBC Tees and made his position clear.

He said: “Two words come to mind, one is that I’m disappointed and another is that I’m absolutely flabbergasted.

“Conversations been going on behind closed doors, I’ve spoken directly with Mark Ives of the National League, I’ve spoken with other chairmen, we all know what we’ve been through, and for this…

“Let’s just remember, we had to provide just cause for not fulfilling a fixture and we put forward a very strong case on two points – one was financial. We’d lost £50,000 for two consecutive months and if anybody was to come and inspect the books of Darlington at that point in time – let’s just say the bring in an independent auditor – an independent expert expert would find it very difficult to say actually the club can afford to play when they’re losing £50,000 per month. They would find in our favour that we had financial just cause not to play. That’s the first point.

“Secondly, I know it’s in the statement, but there’s no mention of Covid. The health and safety of the players, the staff, the stewards – and that was also in our defence, saying that as we are elite sport, but we had no covid testing supplied.

“We have a duty of care as employers to our staff and until such a regime was put in place we believe that the onus was on the National League to ensure that that they provided the right equipment to enable us to continue in a safe and controlled manner.



“The fact there’s no mention of health and safety in their statement, again, as a business director in other spheres, absolutely staggers me. It smacks of incompetence at the highest level. So that’s the two issues on just cause.

“That fact is we were misled at the start of the season – loans versus grants. The board openly admitted they didn’t take any minutes around the allocation of funding to ensure moving forward it would be grants.

“If the league read its own rulebook at the time, once you’ve submitted your budget – unless they’ve change the rules – we can’t take loans, and now the league is saying ‘well actually we didn’t say it would all be grants moving forward, it would be reviewed’.

“For another point of view, and I know I’m on my high horse here, we were asked to produce a vote on a null and void basis. At the time of the vote the National League said null and void – we voted and the league was declared null and void. In legal parlance, that means it never happened. So, how can the league now finest for something that didn’t happen?

“It is very interesting to note, however, that the league has changed its terminology to say oh no, the season was curtailed. Obviously when we voted it was null and void.”

He added: “You’d think the National League would want to move on and start the season with all the clubs behind it, putting the whole horrific issue around Covid, the lockdown and everything behind us and start with a fresh clean slate.

“If this is their olive branch then I’m incredulous.

“Their credibility is gone and I simply do not trust the National League board.

“Yes, we will appeal and will then review and if necessary we make take legal action. That’s not what we wanted to do, we wanted to start season in a very positive light and get on with what we want to do which is simply play football, but it has to be played with the right circumstances.



“I’m now even more convinced that we need to look at governance in non-league football and probably even in the Football League and above. To make decisions like this, you lose credibility, the board loses credibility and the clubs just don’t trust the individuals who are running it.

“So it’s a very sad state to be in I’m quite angry around the whole all situation.”




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lo36789
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Re: Punishment for the Boston game

Post by lo36789 » Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:51 am

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:08 am
Darlofan97 wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 8:59 am
According to Ollie Bayliss, National League clubs are discussing proposing a vote of no confidence in the Chairman & Board of the National League.

The only snippet I’ve heard from Brian Barwick in all of this is speaking out in support of commercial deal. It’s absolutely shambolic.
Bring it on.

Maybe that's what they want?

Thinking about this further, it could work, because even the clubs who haven't been fined (16?) will have a gripe with Ives and co. The likes of Dorking and others who wanted to play on.
The only issue is careful what you wish for. You need willing volunteers to replace those removed from their positions.

Other chairmen have to be nominated to replace those removed from the board. ​I doubt DJ has the time to be on the NL board and CEO of DFC plus his other interests.

Ultimately people are saying the problem with the board is they don't have the experience etc. they all run football clubs.

I can't see it passing either way as I assume to get passed at an EGM you need 75% in favour and that would be in line with normal voting rights (1 per club at Step 1, 4 per division step 2)

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