The truth

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quaker4life
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The truth

Post by quaker4life » Wed Nov 15, 2023 2:58 pm

I think this needs its own thread as it's too much of a ball ache replying to individual threads and I don't want to point fingers or single anybody out and all that kind of thing, however I do want to address some of the quite frankly nonsensical things I've read on this forum following that absolute sh*tshow last night.

First of all, the fans forum on Friday should absolutely go ahead JG, DJ etc need to own this situation and that utterly shameful and embarassing result last night, there is no hiding place and they must face the music so to speak. No doubt emotions will be running high and understandably so but calling it off would send out completely the wrong message. It would appear as though they've simply ran and hid, the fans who travelled last night (and credit to them) deserve answers for that shambles as does the wider fanbase, especially after a record BTB, that result and our current league position is nothing short of a disgrace.

Also suggesting that we should bin Gowling and replace him with Hatfield, Platt and Lawlor until the end of the season is ridiculous, especially on the basis they led us to victory over a team in the league below in the FA Cup. Alun Armstrong couldn't pull us out of this nosedive and seemingly neither can Gowling so it's beyond me why anyone would think they would.

It seems to me some people are looking for quick fixes and sticky plaster solutions but for me there isn't one, what's happening here now reminds of me of what was happening at Sunderland back in 2017/18 when they were relegated from the Championship, the whole place was rotten to the core. The majority of this group of players have been performing poorly for the better part of nine months now and those of you insistent on pinning the blame entirely on Gowling, although he should carry the can for last night, seem to forget that the majority of these players were also in dreadful form under the previous manager, they are just as responsible for this mess and should not be made exempt from any criticism it's too easy to use the manager as a scapegoat when the problems were in that dressing room long before he arrived.

I remember thinking after we won at BPA last season when we were flying this lot won't last five minutes in the National League, case in point that the two promoted sides from the NLN last season currently occupy the bottom two in the NL, but even after last season's spectacular collapse I never imagined we'd find ourselves in a relegation battle in the NLN this season but here we are.

There's too much dead wood and too many passengers in this squad at the moment and the summer is a way off yet, they either shape up or they need shipping out. There's too many players at this club who have been performing poorly too regularly for too long, so to expect a striker who has had limited game time over the last year and has been out injured since April to suddenly be our lord and saviour is magical thinking to say the least.

The truth is we're not good enough and changing managers like changing socks isn't going to make us good enough, there is no magic wand we've got to somehow muddle through this season and hopefully find a way to dig ourselves out of this hole.
love it! wrote:Considering we are Darlington 1883 I'm happy that we are named correctly

The_Natural
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Re: The truth

Post by The_Natural » Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:14 pm

Excellent post, only thing I disagree with is the ‘rotten to the core’comment I think that’s unfair and assume you are referring to the playing side

Agree with the comments on let’s replace Gowling with 3 of the players suggestion, some people think this is a game
Of football manager it seems

I think Gowling staying is the least bad option we have left as we try and recover from the absolute disastrous management in terms of recruitment and motivation over the last 9 months

LoidLucan
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Re: The truth

Post by LoidLucan » Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:27 pm

quaker4life wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 2:58 pm
I think this needs its own thread as it's too much of a ball ache replying to individual threads and I don't want to point fingers or single anybody out and all that kind of thing, however I do want to address some of the quite frankly nonsensical things I've read on this forum following that absolute sh*tshow last night.

First of all, the fans forum on Friday should absolutely go ahead JG, DJ etc need to own this situation and that utterly shameful and embarassing result last night, there is no hiding place and they must face the music so to speak. No doubt emotions will be running high and understandably so but calling it off would send out completely the wrong message. It would appear as though they've simply ran and hid, the fans who travelled last night (and credit to them) deserve answers for that shambles as does the wider fanbase, especially after a record BTB, that result and our current league position is nothing short of a disgrace.

Also suggesting that we should bin Gowling and replace him with Hatfield, Platt and Lawlor until the end of the season is ridiculous, especially on the basis they led us to victory over a team in the league below in the FA Cup. Alun Armstrong couldn't pull us out of this nosedive and seemingly neither can Gowling so it's beyond me why anyone would think they would.

It seems to me some people are looking for quick fixes and sticky plaster solutions but for me there isn't one, what's happening here now reminds of me of what was happening at Sunderland back in 2017/18 when they were relegated from the Championship, the whole place was rotten to the core. The majority of this group of players have been performing poorly for the better part of nine months now and those of you insistent on pinning the blame entirely on Gowling, although he should carry the can for last night, seem to forget that the majority of these players were also in dreadful form under the previous manager, they are just as responsible for this mess and should not be made exempt from any criticism it's too easy to use the manager as a scapegoat when the problems were in that dressing room long before he arrived.

I remember thinking after we won at BPA last season when we were flying this lot won't last five minutes in the National League, case in point that the two promoted sides from the NLN last season currently occupy the bottom two in the NL, but even after last season's spectacular collapse I never imagined we'd find ourselves in a relegation battle in the NLN this season but here we are.

There's too much dead wood and too many passengers in this squad at the moment and the summer is a way off yet, they either shape up or they need shipping out. There's too many players at this club who have been performing poorly too regularly for too long, so to expect a striker who has had limited game time over the last year and has been out injured since April to suddenly be our lord and saviour is magical thinking to say the least.

The truth is we're not good enough and changing managers like changing socks isn't going to make us good enough, there is no magic wand we've got to somehow muddle through this season and hopefully find a way to dig ourselves out of this hole.
In other words do nothing and ignore the many things the manager has done to make a bad situation worse. I am firmly of the belief that had the right appointment been made, things could have turned out entirely different. You only have to look at King's Lynn and Southport to see that. Both are clubs with limited resources who have largely made the best use of existing, under-performing squads with their new managers who have instilled organisation, spirit and belief and brought in one or two of the right sort of signings.
Last edited by LoidLucan on Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The_Natural
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Re: The truth

Post by The_Natural » Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:36 pm

Lucan you maybe right that a different better appointment could have been made, but we need to think what gives us the best chance of survival going fwd.
Ideal solution would be a Time Machine so we could tear up the last jokers two year deal before he signed it but that is obviously not an option

Paying for a 3rd manager (or another 3 as you want to do—-not sure why you are expecting them to take on more responsibility for no additional payment) doesn’t seem sensible or helpful to the future of the club

Old Git
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Re: The truth

Post by Old Git » Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:40 pm

Good post Quakerforlife. I agree that now is not the time for a knee jerk reaction and to sack the manager without a plan for the future. The players, all of them regardless of their age, need to step up to the plate and give their all over the next few months on the pitch. If they can escape relegation then great, if not so be it, but at least give it a real go. If anyone does not fancy it, we can rip up their contracts and bring in some lads who will wear the shirt with pride.
However, prior to last night’s debacle there were some more encouraging signs against Farsley and Chester, so escaping relegation may still be possible, if confidence has not been irrevocably damaged after last night. Pulling this around is going to be a real test of character for players, manager and everyone connected with the club, and we the fans have a part to play as well. Now is not a time for infighting, but a time for coming together with a bit of Dunkirk spirit. United we might just pull it off, divided we are sunk.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: The truth

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:43 pm

The forum worries me tbh.
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The_Natural
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Re: The truth

Post by The_Natural » Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:56 pm

I think calmer heads will prevail, the entitled loudmouths on here demanding gowlings head and complaining at the board who work their backsides off will hopefully be a little more circumspect

PierremontQuaker03
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Re: The truth

Post by PierremontQuaker03 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:17 pm

Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
“If you can't hit a driver, don't.”
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LoidLucan
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Re: The truth

Post by LoidLucan » Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:33 pm

The_Natural wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 3:56 pm
I think calmer heads will prevail, the entitled loudmouths on here demanding gowlings head and complaining at the board who work their backsides off will hopefully be a little more circumspect
Presumably by "entitled loudmouths" you mean passionate supporters of Darlington FC who take a different view of things to you.

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Quaker85
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Re: The truth

Post by Quaker85 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:47 pm

PierremontQuaker03 wrote:Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
What do you want them to say Image


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CrazyDarlo
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Re: The truth

Post by CrazyDarlo » Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:08 pm

PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:17 pm
Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
There was a post match interview with our manager in which he apologised to supporters. What else are we meant to do? If you’re after more communication there’s a fans forum in 48 hours.

LoidLucan
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Re: The truth

Post by LoidLucan » Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:26 pm

I don't think even a public bout of self flagellation by JG and the entire team would be enough to atone for or eradicate the memory of last night's humiliation :oops:

AndyPark
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Re: The truth

Post by AndyPark » Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:45 pm

CrazyDarlo wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:08 pm
PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:17 pm
Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
There was a post match interview with our manager in which he apologised to supporters. What else are we meant to do? If you’re after more communication there’s a fans forum in 48 hours.
I would not be shocked if this is cancelled again mind.

Yarblockos
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Re: The truth

Post by Yarblockos » Wed Nov 15, 2023 6:10 pm

I don't think as a club we are "rotten to the core" but we've been on a downward spiral for the last 11 months for sure. I would like to know how we've got to where we are if we have a top half budget. That takes some mismanagement. The expectations for this season were set so low that there seemed to be an air of despondency around the club before the season even kicked off. There is somehow a feeling that we can't achieve anything at BM, that we are treading water, and as a conseqence there seems no serious ambition on the playing front. That comes from the top. I know DJ seems beyond criticism on here, but while we may be financially sound we have gone backward. To take this club down would be a major failure for any board.

quakersam
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Re: The truth

Post by quakersam » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:02 pm

CrazyDarlo wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:08 pm
PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:17 pm
Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
There was a post match interview with our manager in which he apologised to supporters. What else are we meant to do? If you’re after more communication there’s a fans forum in 48 hours.
The worst Darlington result since 1987, that’s some going. Why not just put a short statement out saying “We apologise to the travelling supporters for last nights performance, we as a board of directors and management team will come together to understand what went wrong last night and we will do our utmost to repay your fantastic ongoing support”

It doesn’t have to say much. I understand this may set a dangerous precedent but the whole club was humiliated last night
QuakerSam ...Once a Quaker, always a Quaker

PierremontQuaker03
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Re: The truth

Post by PierremontQuaker03 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:11 pm

quakersam wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:02 pm
CrazyDarlo wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:08 pm
PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:17 pm
Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
There was a post match interview with our manager in which he apologised to supporters. What else are we meant to do? If you’re after more communication there’s a fans forum in 48 hours.
The worst Darlington result since 1987, that’s some going. Why not just put a short statement out saying “We apologise to the travelling supporters for last nights performance, we as a board of directors and management team will come together to understand what went wrong last night and we will do our utmost to repay your fantastic ongoing support”

It doesn’t have to say much. I understand this may set a dangerous precedent but the whole club was humiliated last night
Spot on something like this would have been fine. I can’t see the fans forum going ahead, it’s going to be too toxic an atmosphere.
“If you can't hit a driver, don't.”
Greg Norman

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CrazyDarlo
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Re: The truth

Post by CrazyDarlo » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:16 pm

quakersam wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:02 pm
CrazyDarlo wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:08 pm
PierremontQuaker03 wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:17 pm
Worst defeat in 37 years and nothing from the club...nothing.
There was a post match interview with our manager in which he apologised to supporters. What else are we meant to do? If you’re after more communication there’s a fans forum in 48 hours.
The worst Darlington result since 1987, that’s some going. Why not just put a short statement out saying “We apologise to the travelling supporters for last nights performance, we as a board of directors and management team will come together to understand what went wrong last night and we will do our utmost to repay your fantastic ongoing support”

It doesn’t have to say much. I understand this may set a dangerous precedent but the whole club was humiliated last night
I’m sure that will be reiterated at the fans forum which I believe will be going ahead.

Darlofan97
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Re: The truth

Post by Darlofan97 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:21 pm

Why wait another 48 hours?

A simple, well-worded, and calm statement from the club, or one of the more senior players on behalf of the players, would go a little way to easing last night’s humiliation.

Lack of character.

The_Natural
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Re: The truth

Post by The_Natural » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:23 pm

I would rather people got on with fixing it than spouting meaningless platitudes…best way the team can repay the fans is with improved performances

shildonlad
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Re: The truth

Post by shildonlad » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:33 pm

Has a refund been offered to travelling fans like gateshead did after the fa cup defeat to yeovil
I may not live in the north east anymore but i still support the north east teams

Darlofan97
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Re: The truth

Post by Darlofan97 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:38 pm

shildonlad wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:33 pm
Has a refund been offered to travelling fans like gateshead did after the fa cup defeat to yeovil
Don’t be daft.

That would require a bit of tact.

The_Natural
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Re: The truth

Post by The_Natural » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:39 pm

shildonlad wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:33 pm
Has a refund been offered to travelling fans like gateshead did after the fa cup defeat to yeovil
Should the fans be asked to pay double if we win by a certain amount ?

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CrazyDarlo
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Re: The truth

Post by CrazyDarlo » Thu Nov 16, 2023 12:45 am

Darlofan97 wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:38 pm
shildonlad wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:33 pm
Has a refund been offered to travelling fans like gateshead did after the fa cup defeat to yeovil
Don’t be daft.

That would require a bit of tact.
Refunds for supporters just because the game didn’t go your way is complete nonsense. It’s part and parcel of being a football fan. That’s speaking as someone who was there last night.

AndyPark
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Re: The truth

Post by AndyPark » Thu Nov 16, 2023 11:14 am

shildonlad wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:33 pm
Has a refund been offered to travelling fans like gateshead did after the fa cup defeat to yeovil
I hate it when people say this, you go to games to watch your team win or lose.

I wouldn't expect any money back from any away game I have attended.

Quakers2009
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Re: The truth

Post by Quakers2009 » Thu Nov 16, 2023 12:44 pm

I wouldn't either, BUT the club could have at least offered something as a quick-win before the fans-forum on Friday...

In the grand scheme of things and all that...

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Lawman3
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Re: The truth

Post by Lawman3 » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:13 pm

Yeah, we could always fundraise from the fans to raise the money to reimburse the fans. Christ almighty🙄
Never argue with an idiot: The best possible outcome is that you win an argument with an idiot.

Quakers2009
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Re: The truth

Post by Quakers2009 » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:20 pm

Completely missing the point.

Barely anyone would actually take up the reimbursement, but it's a PR win, a virtuous gift.

Or shall we remain silent after our worst result in decades & allow things to build up for tomorrow night? Looks like it.

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CrazyDarlo
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Re: The truth

Post by CrazyDarlo » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:43 pm

Quakers2009 wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:20 pm
Completely missing the point.

Barely anyone would actually take up the reimbursement, but it's a PR win, a virtuous gift.

Or shall we remain silent after our worst result in decades & allow things to build up for tomorrow night? Looks like it.
So what pot of the fans money are you taking from to cover these reimbursements? Boost the budget? 50/50 sales? Other clubs with rich owners can do this as a PR stunt but it’s not what we’re about.

Quakers2009
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Re: The truth

Post by Quakers2009 » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:49 pm

CrazyDarlo wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:43 pm
Quakers2009 wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:20 pm
Completely missing the point.

Barely anyone would actually take up the reimbursement, but it's a PR win, a virtuous gift.

Or shall we remain silent after our worst result in decades & allow things to build up for tomorrow night? Looks like it.
So what pot of the fans money are you taking from to cover these reimbursements? Boost the budget? 50/50 sales? Other clubs with rich owners can do this as a PR stunt but it’s not what we’re about.
The club has cash in the bank and generates income aside from BTB/50-50 sales/gate-receipts.

How many travelled/how many would actually go for the reimbursement? I'd bet about ten, and that's being generous.

You don't have to have rich owners to pay that out, and I can assure you, we've tried PR stunts before to benefit the club - so this isn't alien.

BM1883
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Re: The truth

Post by BM1883 » Thu Nov 16, 2023 2:11 pm

Quakers2009 wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:49 pm
CrazyDarlo wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:43 pm
Quakers2009 wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:20 pm
Completely missing the point.

Barely anyone would actually take up the reimbursement, but it's a PR win, a virtuous gift.

Or shall we remain silent after our worst result in decades & allow things to build up for tomorrow night? Looks like it.
So what pot of the fans money are you taking from to cover these reimbursements? Boost the budget? 50/50 sales? Other clubs with rich owners can do this as a PR stunt but it’s not what we’re about.
The club has cash in the bank and generates income aside from BTB/50-50 sales/gate-receipts.

How many travelled/how many would actually go for the reimbursement? I'd bet about ten, and that's being generous.

You don't have to have rich owners to pay that out, and I can assure you, we've tried PR stunts before to benefit the club - so this isn't alien.
Spot on, Quakers2009.

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