World Cup

[TSQuaker]

Neymar was quality in the Confederations Cup last Summer. He scored two goals in his first game without really turning it on. They'll beat Cameroon in their last game without too much trouble, so will probably get through the group stages without really finding that second gear.

Spyman is right though, he's getting most of the attention because he's the poster boy of Brazilian football.

[Spyman]

So we are a round down and who is thinking what? my views on the big few and others to have made an impact

Holland : Clearly a very good game but i suspect they won't keep that up and teams won't capitulate as Spain did, i think we may have seen their hand too early.

Brazil : Much as expected, solid but don't have the attacking potency that we normally expect. i think they will get better, but winning it im no sure, they need the momentum to change.

Spain : Clearly must get better and a HUGE game for them tonight v Chile who have more to show than what we saw v Australia

Italy : Perhaps stronger than I thought, a very very good midfield 3, but a lot will come down to how many goals Balotelli can get. They will go further than i thought which was second round.

Belgium : I missed their game so not sure how they looked. But Russia and Korea should offer no threats to them getting through.

Germany : Exceptional, took Portugal apart with or without the red card. And that was without a full back or a forward.

Argentina : Did not set the world on fire but I still have them as my fav's. They will find there feet and get stronger.

France : My biggest surprise, I was not expecting much from them and i thought they looked very impressive. There my new dark horse.

Mexico, look good, better than there qualifying suggested and Croatia will also have say in group A.

After round 1 England still look in it and are not as far away from the top teams that many of us think, we could easily cruise through with 6 points or crash with 0 but a little luck and we should be through and with momentum. Game on.

I'd agree with most of that.

France have snuck in largely under the radar, and Ribery's injury probably meant most wrote them off completely - but they're still a very useful side who usually perform when it counts. In Cabaye and Pogba they have an excellent midfield pairing.

Italy as you say are good, plenty of experience and know how. However, if anything happens to Pirlo they're buggered. They have other good players, but their entire game plan is built around Pirlo - you just have to look at how much of the ball he sees. Everything goes through him. Take him out and I suspect they'd fall apart. But while he's fit and available, they're a match for anyone.

Argentina, if Messi and Aguero are firing, are as big a threat as anyone. I have them and Germany down as the best two teams at the moment.

Holland are similar to England in my mind. A young team with 2 or 3 players who have bags of experience. Potential to be very exciting, but also probably vulnerable and slightly naive with all of the youth in the side.

Spain are not finished, but are also not the force of 4 years ago. Still very capable of going all the way if they play with confidence but are vulnerable.

Incidentally, and lo36789 just touched on it - a lot is made of Diego Costa having binned off Brazil for Spain, but I really don't rate him. At all. Yes he scored bags for Atletico, but he looks out of his depth. He has only had one really top season and other than that has been a bit of a journeyman throughout his career. I think Chelsea are mugs if they're paying £30 million for him.

[lo36789]

Incidentally, and lo36789 just touched on it - a lot is made of Diego Costa having binned off Brazil for Spain, but I really don't rate him. At all. Yes he scored bags for Atletico, but he looks out of his depth. He has only had one really top season and other than that has been a bit of a journeyman throughout his career. I think Chelsea are mugs if they're paying £30 million for him.

I agree, but I also think he is better than Fred/Jo so would have strolled into the Brazil line up ahead of them.

[DarloOnTheUp]

Overall, when you compare them with Germany, for example, they do have a number of average players in and around their team and as I said some time ago, I'd be surprised if they make any real impression at this World Cup.

Agreed. I didn't think they would win the World Cup before it started, and I still don't. I'm not a fan of Scolari either: Chelsea were rubbish under him and he won the World Cup with Brazil simply because of how good some of their players were at the time.

Brazil have been able to pick Diego Costa for years yet they opted for Fred instead, and that's why Costa changed his allegiance to Spain. I don't blame him to be honest. That decision was merely down to poor management. Pato USED to be amazing but he's went severely downhill after a number of injuries, sadly, yet I imagine he's still better than Jo (although I haven't seen him play since he was at Milan).

I reckon either Germany or Spain will win it. Spain's hammering against Holland could be a blessing in disguise as they should buck their ideas up now.

Incidentally, and lo36789 just touched on it - a lot is made of Diego Costa having binned off Brazil for Spain, but I really don't rate him. At all. Yes he scored bags for Atletico, but he looks out of his depth. He has only had one really top season and other than that has been a bit of a journeyman throughout his career. I think Chelsea are mugs if they're paying £30 million for him.

He's worth it, and you're vastly underrating him.

[TSQuaker]

I'm also not overly convinced by Diego Costa. His record in previous seasons hasn't been outstanding by any means. I wouldn't pay £30m based on one (admittedly very good) season.

[DarloOnTheUp]

He wasn't that bad against Holland, but yeah, he wasn't great either. He always impressed me when I saw him play for Atletico last season though, so don't write him off after one game.

[TSQuaker]

Oh I agree, I watch a lot of La Liga myself and he usually impressed me. I'm just interested to see whether or not he can reproduce it next season.

[Spyman]

He wasn't that bad against Holland, but yeah, he wasn't great either. He always impressed me when I saw him play for Atletico last season though, so don't write him off after one game.

Once again, I'm not writing him off after one game. I have Sky Sports, I've seen him play several times, including before his mega-season.

We've seen plenty of strikers in countries all over the world have an outstanding season, and then look very ordinary. I might be wrong about Costa, but I've not seen anything that makes me think he is worth £30million.

As you alsov say, Brazil have been able to pick Costa for years, but they didn't - largely because for years he didn't have an outstanding goalscoring record and was being loaned out to low-profile clubs.

[DarloOnTheUp]

He wasn't that bad against Holland, but yeah, he wasn't great either. He always impressed me when I saw him play for Atletico last season though, so don't write him off after one game.

Once again, I'm not writing him off after one game. I have Sky Sports, I've seen him play several times, including before his mega-season.

We've seen plenty of strikers in countries all over the world have an outstanding season, and then look very ordinary. I might be wrong about Costa, but I've not seen anything that makes me think he is worth £30million.

As you alsov say, Brazil have been able to pick Costa for years, but they didn't - largely because for years he didn't have an outstanding goalscoring record and was being loaned out to low-profile clubs.

But he's obviously a better player now than in previous seasons, which is why he managed to score 27 goals in the league and 36 overall, and he has been better than Fred and Jo for at least 2 seasons.

Plus his recent goalscoring record alone makes him worth the price tag, but whenever I've seen him play he's always shown that he's much more than just a goalscorer. He had probably the worst game I've seen him play against Holland yet his positioning was still brilliant and he won the penalty.

Anyways, we could argue about how good he is all day as all we can base it on is our own experiences of him, but I guess we'll find out how good he truly is next season or perhaps in the rest of the tournament!

[lo36789]

Plus his recent goalscoring record alone makes him worth the price tag, but whenever I've seen him play he's always shown that he's much more than just a goalscorer. He had probably the worst game I've seen him play against Holland yet his positioning was still brilliant and he won the penalty.

I thought it was one of the better performances I have seen from him. He only headbutted one player needlessly aswell.

I am not convinced. He has a great record last season nobody is denying that. I suspect Spyman may be right come the end of next season but we'll see.

I actually think there is a chance he will get more red cards than goals next year.

[Spyman]

Yep, we'll have to agree to disagree. He may be a player on an upward curve, like you say - or he could be a player who has peaked in a certain team with a certain way of playing.

[DarloOnTheUp]

Well, Costa has been garbage tonight so looks like Spyman might have been right all along.

[Spyman]

Well, Costa has been garbage tonight so looks like Spyman might have been right all along.

Now calm the fuck down and stop judging him on one game....

I only saw the last 20 minutes so can't really comment. What I do know is my £5 e/w bet on Spain at 8/1 is over as quickly as it was possible for it to be over.

Chile clearly good side though, and it makes England's friendly defeat look a little better in theory. I thought they'd qualify but I thought it would be the Dutch that were sent packing early.

Looking forward to seeing Cahill's goal - Robbie Savage was orgasmic over it on the radio earlier.

[grytters]

Adios Espana!

How many of us would have predicted that?

[lo36789]

After the Netherlands game I am not that surprised. The ball was in Chile's court from that point onwards. They could have played for draws against Spain and NL and guaranteed themselves qualification.

As it happens they managed to get on the front foot, got a goal and from there Spain's lack of penetration was telling. They needed a Torres from, well 5 seasons ago now.

Chile were decent. I am struggling a little bit to take a team with Gary Medel at CB that seriously though. If you can run at him I think you would cause problems.

[joejaques]

Adios Espana!

How many of us would have predicted that?

Don't be shouting yet. They may only be on the plane in front of England because they played before us.

[lo36789]

Adios Espana!

How many of us would have predicted that?

Don't be shouting yet. They may only be on the plane in front of England because they played before us.

Surely that would be a success for Greg Dyke. He wants us to emulate Spain after all...that is why we are getting B leagues isn't it?

[grytters]

Meanwhile.

This is for all those Spanish supporters on the big screen in the Maracanã last night…

http://thesunshineroom.com/2012/05/08/a ... wooo-yeah/

[theoriginalfatcat]

Surely that would be a success for Greg Dyke. He wants us to emulate Spain after all...that is why we are getting B leagues isn't it?

Time for a Greg Dyke rethink


This is the best World Cup we've had for a long long time.

[BaronsCourtQuaker]

"Spain : Clearly must get better and a HUGE game for them tonight v Chile who have more to show than what we saw v Australia"

Well I suppose I hedged my bets. Spain were woeful and Chile were fantastic. I do wonder what went on with Spain, they looked so uninterested for the off, never got going and although they don't have a striker to speak off (on form) they gave the ball away so incredibly easy. Was also very surprised that Fabragas did not get a run out.

I can see the Aussies being very up for that game. I'm sure they came to the tournament expecting no points, but they have put up a decent show and I suspect will be more up for it than the Spanish.

Nerves are starting to kick in for the England game tonight, I go from supreme confidence to giving us no chance in the space of minutes. I can't cope with Suarez putting us out.

[DarloOnTheUp]

Who does everyone think is gonna win it now?

[TSQuaker]

Brazil for me. I know they've hardly set the world alight so far but I think they'll turn it on when it matters.

[lo36789]

well that was disappointing! I didn't expect us to finish bottom of the group that is for sure, but that is more likely than us qualifying right now!

Stevie Gerrard has had a torrid end to the 2014 season really hasn't he. Thought Rooney was good tonight, defence was shaky (we knew it would be), Sterling didn't really get into the game.

Suarez really is first class!

[shawry]

well that was disappointing! I didn't expect us to finish bottom of the group that is for sure, but that is more likely than us qualifying right now!

Stevie Gerrard has had a torrid end to the 2014 season really hasn't he. Thought Rooney was good tonight, defence was shaky (we knew it would be), Sterling didn't really get into the game.

Suarez really is first class!

I expect us to finish 3rd missing out to Costa Rica on goal difference

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[Darlogramps]

Very disappointing - Suarez was the difference. He's a world class player, England don't have one.

Defensively, I actually thought Cahill looked all right, until his mis-communication with Gerrard at the end cost us.

But there has to be major doubts over Johnson and Jagielka - except who else comes in?

Up front, Rooney finally looked decent, Welbeck and Sterling struggled to get involved. I think 4-3-3 would work better for England, than Roy's 4-2-3-1/4-4-1-1.

I really think Barkley should also start. His energy, pace and creativity gave us an extra spark going forward.

We are all but out, but the Costa Rica game is crucial for the future direction of the team. They need a performance and a result - otherwise there'll be questions about Hodgson, who's done an otherwise decent job since taking over so far in my opinion.

There has been progress, but sadly we're just not good enough right now. Far too familiar story.

[al_quaker]

Hmm. Didn't play as well as we did against Italy, but we were much the better side. The difference was Suarez, with 2 great finishes.

How on earth Godin stayed on the pitch I have no idea. If the ref had the balls to send him off, then it's a completely different game. Even then, we did enough to win the game, but weren't quite clinical enough.

Clearly the defence is a worry. Over the next 2 years we really could do with a top class centre back partnership emerging, and some alternatives to Johnson at right back (who had a decent enough game tonight to be fair). However, I'm still optimistic about the future. Plenty of talented young players, who should only get better. We dominated possession tonight (63%), and had twice as many completed passes (354 to 164). Those stats of course mean nothing, as all that counts is how many goals are scored, but they show a shift in the way England play against the better teams. We are developing into a team that aren't far away from competing.

Overall, disappointed, but still optimistic about the future. I can't see us qualifying from the group, but I really hope Hodgson stays on, and we carry on developing as a team in the way we are.

[Darlogramps]

Agree about Hodgson, for two reasons.

1. He's developed a promising team, which isn't yet the finished article. Needs to be allowed to complete the job. My fear is that if we flop vs Costa Rica, then people will look for a scapegoat.

2. Who else could take over?

Genuine question - what about Gerrard's future? I've never really seen him do much for England and he's probably over his peak.

His decision to shoot at the end, rather than pass out wide to Johnson, typified his approach. For me, it's time to move on from him.

[shawry]

Sick of hearing commentators saying that we want to see out fullbacks doing what they do best nd getting forward and crossing the ball. How about as defenders they do that best, then get forward

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[al_quaker]

Agree about Hodgson, for two reasons.

1. He's developed a promising team, which isn't yet the finished article. Needs to be allowed to complete the job. My fear is that if we flop vs Costa Rica, then people will look for a scapegoat.

2. Who else could take over?

Genuine question - what about Gerrard's future? I've never really seen him do much for England and he's probably over his peak.

His decision to shoot at the end, rather than pass out wide to Johnson, typified his approach. For me, it's time to move on from him.

Indeed. If Hodgson leaves, and we go down the English manager route, who would it be? Redknapp? Pardew? Bruce? No thanks.

I can see Gerrard retiring after the world cup. Replacing him will be hard. Carrick would do a job over the next 2 years I think (and perhaps for the job Gerrard is in the team to do a better one?), but long term? Rodwell is one who needs to get away from Man City and start playing regular football. Plenty of ability, but hasn't played in about 10 years.


Anyway, having just been thinking about it, if Italy win their final 2 games (feasible), worst case scenario is that we'd have to beat Costa Rica by 2 goals to go through. It's pretty much nailed on

[lo36789]

Sick of hearing commentators saying that we want to see out fullbacks doing what they do best nd getting forward and crossing the ball. How about as defenders they do that best, then get forward

Don't know if I agree you play to your strengths. The point of Henderson/Gerrard playing holding roles is so they can attack.

I can see Gerrard retiring after the world cup. Replacing him will be hard. Carrick would do a job over the next 2 years I think

I'd rather not go back to Carrick, I think it's Wilshere alongside Henderson for me. We should have Chalobah coming through pretty soon and as you say maybe Rodwell if he can get out of City.

Hart
Flanagan/Stones/Jones/Shaw
Henderson/Wilshere (Cleverley/Chalobah/Rodwell, longer term Ryan Ledson)
4 from...Sterling/Walcott/Oxlade-Chamberlain/Townsend/Welbeck/Rooney/Sturridge/Lallana/Barkley (maybe even Connor Wickham!?)