Club fine

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onewayup
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Club fine

Post by onewayup » Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:21 am

No information been released weather the fine has been withdrawn or implemented .
Hopefully it is withdrawn.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Club fine

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:06 am

I've been waiting on this too, fingers crossed.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

eddie-rowles
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Re: Club fine

Post by eddie-rowles » Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:19 am

I fear it has not gone well and DJ furious or been kicked down the road as is the usual FA way , if it had been over turned pretty sure club would be announcing straight away.

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don'tbuythesun
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Re: Club fine

Post by don'tbuythesun » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:04 am

I can't see anything about this anywhere so maybe the decisions not been made. If its upheld maybe we can all chuck a few quid in. At least it's not £3.5 million-we'd definitely be in trouble then!!

Old Git
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Re: Club fine

Post by Old Git » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:10 am

Are any other teams appealing fines? If so could a decision be delayed until all appeals have been completed.

MikeinBlack2
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Re: Club fine

Post by MikeinBlack2 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:30 am

I thought the hearing is on Monday? Just realised it should have been yesterday. \probably waiting until everyone has calmed down before drafting a press release lol
Come on Darlo!
Smoke me a kipper....I'll be back for breakfast!

jjljks
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Re: Club fine

Post by jjljks » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:48 am

We should send them a letter thanking them for their contribution to BTB instead of paying any fine, depending on if they also fine the "Super League" miscreants

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Club fine

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:58 am

There a number of appeals re these fines, I did know the figure but I've forgotten - it was more than 10 I think, so seeing as some of the reasons for stopping will be similar (no testing/running insolvently against league rules) it will be interesting to see if there is a split. If some fines are adhered to and others not then what?
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

spen666
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Re: Club fine

Post by spen666 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 3:14 pm

don'tbuythesun wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:04 am
I can't see anything about this anywhere so maybe the decisions not been made. If its upheld maybe we can all chuck a few quid in. At least it's not £3.5 million-we'd definitely be in trouble then!!


Relative to clubs' turnover, Darlo and others probably got hammered more for this than The 6 for their little misdemeanor

Darlogramps
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Club fine

Post by Darlogramps » Sat Jun 12, 2021 11:12 am

Hi Spen, since you’re commenting on us financially, what’s your opinion of our Boost the Budget?

Given you’ve described it as “annual bucket rattling” on Twitter.

Pretty strange behaviour for a grown man to be so two-faced on social media, all because you’re desperate for people to like you.
If ever you're bored or miserable:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlZohZoadGY

Ghost_Of_1883
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Re: Club fine

Post by Ghost_Of_1883 » Sat Jun 12, 2021 1:20 pm

It's hard to discern whether he is simply fishing for bites because he thinks Darlo fans will rise to it (but doesn't really believe we are bucket rattlers or whatever the joke of the day is), OR that he really does believe that we're "rattling buckets" or whatever he is tweeting about at that moment.

But the best thing is, no Darlo fan can be bothered to reply, or re-tweet, or like, ever.

He's like the nutter with the sandwich board saying "the end is nigh", that wanders around mumbling and shouting, that no one takes any notice of.
#Arenaherewecome

Old Git
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Re: Club fine

Post by Old Git » Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:03 am

Latest news from the club is that there is no news yet on the appeal. Along with several other clubs we are still waiting to hear what has been ruled. Presumably an announcement on all of the appeals will be made together in due course.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Club fine

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:48 pm

Thanks for that OldGit :thumbup:
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

onewayup
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Re: Club fine

Post by onewayup » Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:35 am

Just how have they not made a decision, are they looking for a way to quantify the fine saving face for themselves, I find it incredulous that after hearing the appeal they need to discuss it and selectively pull the appeal apart piece by piece, they really are a loke

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Club fine

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:30 pm

Yes, they really are crap and what concerns me a little is what if C19 comes back this winter? Are there new rules in place to cover a league shut down without fines being incurred.

What's been changed? Will there be "ineptitude-the sequel"
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

lo36789
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Re: Club fine

Post by lo36789 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:47 pm

theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:30 pm
Yes, they really are crap and what concerns me a little is what if C19 comes back this winter? Are there new rules in place to cover a league shut down without fines being incurred.

What's been changed? Will there be "ineptitude-the sequel"
Leagues have been lobbying the FA for well over 12 months now to put some wording in the standardised league rules to no avail. A league cannot be licensed by the FA at steps 1-6 unless they adhere to these rules.

Leagues have had to hold their AGMs already this year without any updated standardised rules this summer...they havent been given a date on when they will be provided.

They have basically approved their adoption "once released" as there is no alternative available.

Basically the only option available is to make a proposal and then get it ratified by the league council's committee on an as hoc basis.

onewayup
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Re: Club fine

Post by onewayup » Mon Jun 14, 2021 1:17 pm

There are meetings being held with fans being asked to participate I have had an email asking if I would like to partake, unfortunately I 'm am otherwise engaged, these meeting are chaired by Tracey Crouch, she wants fans response to the challenges created by the coivd that clubs had to endure,
And fans response to the FA/ national league's decisions. Starting 1st meeting this week.

lo36789
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Re: Club fine

Post by lo36789 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 1:30 pm

I thought that was a wider governance review of football to be honest. Didn't think it was a post mortem of how the covid pandemic was handled...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... nt-of-fans

I do expect the main outcomes will focus on fan representation in boardrooms (the issue will be how that works within company law in terms of voting rights), diversity in boardrooms (currently severely lacking)...I really can't see this getting to a granular enough detail to change the voting structure of the NL in truth.

onewayup
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Re: Club fine

Post by onewayup » Tue Jun 15, 2021 7:21 am

Your right there are alot of things to talk /discuss, that each individual fan will have a different thought on it's the governance of football.

JE93
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Re: Club fine

Post by JE93 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:11 am

Our appeal has been dismissed according to the non-league paper

https://twitter.com/NonLeaguePaper/stat ... 36292?s=19

Link to full decision of the appeal board here: https://www.thefa.com/-/media/files/the ... -2021.ashx

Blyth, Spennymoor and Farsley have their fines halved with the second half suspended. All other clubs who submitted appeals have their appeals dismissed. All suspended 2 point deductions remain in place.

lo36789
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Re: Club fine

Post by lo36789 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:27 am

Summary...the league stance is the rule was breached and we didn't provide evidence of just cause - we made a choice.

The null and void is irrelevant - its the same reason if a player had been sent off in either of the last two seasons eg. for violent conduct the fine and suspension still stand.

14. The position of the League is as follows:

14.1 the Panel was entitled to arrive at the Decision based upon the evidence and submissions before it;
14.2 the season was declared null and void and therefore the results of fixtures were expunged. That has no effect upon breaches of the Rules which remain subject to disciplinary proceedings;
14.3 the Panel took into account the obvious effects of the pandemic both in terms of risk to health and its financial impact;
14.4 the Club failed to adduce sufficient evidence to establish just cause in not fulfilling its obligations under the Rules by not playing the fixture in question. It adduced no evidence and certainly no detailed evidence in respect of its financial ability to meet the fixture. Further no evidence was adduced to challenge the sufficiency of the protocols that were in place to ensure the safety of players and staff at games. The protocols had been approved by the Government and The FA on medical advice. These were the same protocols that the Club played under since the start of the season;
14.5 the Club decided that it did not want to expend money on playing the fixture because it thought it likely the season would be terminated. That was a choice and was not just cause;
14.6 the fine imposed was less than the lowest end of the guidelines. Such a fine could not be described as excessive.


The FA appeal wasn't to re-judge. Just to determine if the outcome by the league was justified.

16. The Appeal Board only reviews the Decision of the independent Panel, it does not carry out a rehearing. It follows that it does not matter that the Appeal Board might have arrived at a different conclusion on breach or on penalty.

I am surprised we tried to claim just cause for not playing the game was due to health and safety concerns when we were happy to play another game.

The reasons are what I expected it is a shame they couldn't have applied some discretion. I wonder how much there was concern about setting a precedent.

The reality is it probably would have cost us £2000 to play the game, so against the clubs who played their games and incurred their costs even with the fines it was probably financially the right call.
Last edited by lo36789 on Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:54 am, edited 2 times in total.

Alfie
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Re: Club fine

Post by Alfie » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:42 am

Also have to pay £1600 costs, and the appeal fee of £250 is retained.

lo36789
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Re: Club fine

Post by lo36789 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:44 am

So we gambled £1850 to escape a £2000 fine?

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Club fine

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:56 am

lo36789 wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:27 am
16. The Appeal Board only reviews the Decision of the independent Panel, it does not carry out a rehearing. It follows that it does not matter that the Appeal Board might have arrived at a different conclusion on breach or on penalty.
As a good friend of mine used to say "what's the point"

Screwed over by the pandemic/screwed over by the league...........
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

spen666
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Re: Club fine

Post by spen666 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:57 am

lo36789 wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:27 am
...

16. The Appeal Board only reviews the Decision of the independent Panel, it does not carry out a rehearing. It follows that it does not matter that the Appeal Board might have arrived at a different conclusion on breach or on penalty.

....
Is that the Appeal Board hinting that they wouldn't have reached the same decision as the original panel?

Old Git
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Re: Club fine

Post by Old Git » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:59 am

Well what a surprise. Typical of the decision makers in football and didn’t expect anything else. At least they are consistent even if it is consistently stupid. Hope we now just suck it up pay the fine and costs and move on a little bit wiser in the knowledge that we are dealing with arseholes.
Onwards and upwards next season.
Last edited by Old Git on Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

lo36789
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Re: Club fine

Post by lo36789 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:00 pm

Maybe.

But strictly just that it doesn't matter what they would have decided.

jjljks
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Re: Club fine

Post by jjljks » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:11 pm

No surprise or justice from the appeal, however it should be used as a spur for Tracey Crouch to give this cosy organisation a kick in the groin. No blame can be attached to DJ & our board as I believe most of the fans also wanted to air our grievance. Let's do a special 50/50 draw and use the proceeds to pay the fine. Noli illegitimati te carborundum - don't let the bastards grind you down.

lo36789
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Re: Club fine

Post by lo36789 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:12 pm

jjljks wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:11 pm
No surprise or justice from the appeal, however it should be used as a spur for Tracey Crouch to give this cosy organisation a kick in the groin. No blame can be attached to DJ & our board as I believe most of the fans also wanted to air our grievance. Let's do a special 50/50 draw and use the proceeds to pay the fine. Noli illegitimati te carborundum - don't let the bastards grind you down.
You have very high hopes of a politician lead enquiry tbh.

Check the Tory donors list and make sure there aren't any senior football reps there...as that will probably tell you what the outcome will be.

Got to remember this whole review suddenly became important quite shortly after Boris couldn't understand why he couldn't influence the takeover of Newcastle United.
Last edited by lo36789 on Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

LoidLucan
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Re: Club fine

Post by LoidLucan » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:20 pm

Aside from the rights and wrongs of the ruling, anyone who uses the word "adduce" and then repeats it over and over needs their nuts kicking... metaphorically speaking of course!
Last edited by LoidLucan on Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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